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AZGF to ban salt/baiting


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#1 huntlines

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I know feeders, salt and baiting has been a heated topic over the years and even in this forum. No matter what side of the issue you are on it appears game and fish is attempting to put the issue at rest. The game and fish department has a proposed rule change to “prohibit edible or ingestible substances” to be used to attract game.

“The rule is amended to prohibit the use of edible or ingestible substances to attract big game for the purposes of hunting”

This can be found at http://www.azgfd.gov....ticle3NPRM.pdf

It is open for public comment and I encourage everyone to take the time to contact game and fish to make comments. Whether you are for it or against it we should be providing input. I understand this is to try to avoid the spread of diseases and unusual high concentrations of animals. In Arizona our game animals have been in decline so high concentrations isn't an issue to me. The disease issue is also debateable and I don't feel there is enough proof this causes the spreed of disease.

I do not like the game and fish department placing restrictions such as these on hunters. It recently took the state legislature to act to get restrictions on silencers and high capacity magazines lifted. Again it doesn’t matter what side of the issue you are on in regards to high capacity magazine and silencers. The issue here is unnecessary to be placing these restrictions on hunters. People who want to use extended magazines can and those who do not won’t.

Unfortunately these restrictions will be affecting primarily archery hunters. I know there are some who feel the game and fish are constantly unfairly targeting the archery hunters. This can arguably be one of those examples but regardless we should all be a part of this discussion. Please make your feelings heard to the game and fish department.

Please send an email to the address below to make your feelings heard,

Rulemaking@azgfd.gov


#2 bobbyo

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Unfortunately these restrictions will be affecting primarily archery hunters. I know there are some who feel the game and fish are constantly unfairly targeting the archery hunters. This can arguably be one of those examples but regardless we should all be a part of this discussion. Please make your feelings heard to the game and fish department.



Rulemaking@azgfd.gov


Its not just a " FEELING". Its a FACT that Archery hunters are second class hunters and targeted by Game and fish. Archery is the Red headed stepchild to rifle hunters. This law is nothing more than rifle only hunters and rifle only guides that are pissed because archery hunters are killing more trophy deer than rifle hunters. In addition the success rate of some archery guides that happen to be sponsors of this site is also a major reason. Game and Fish is fine with archery hunters just as long as they don't kill anything. I predict a major reduction in archery elk tags in the future. Archery hunters please stop stealing the rifle hunters animals. Please.

#3 SunDevil

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FYI - archery elk tags in unit 10 this year went from 150 bull to 200 bull AND 75 cow. that is a 83% INCREASE in archery elk tags.

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#4 bobbyo

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Sun Devil,
Good point I was using scare tactics. We both know it is much easier to kill an Elk in the rutt then it is to kill a Coues over salt, So any arguments used against hunting coues a certain way could be used against Elk hunting. Lets ban hyper hot calls and waterhole hunting for elk and we could probably double the tags in unit 10, In addition, I would only count the 33% increase in bull tags.Do you think 33% more bulls were killed in unit 10 this year? The cow tags in that particular unit because of the open terrain will probably have a much lower success rate then a unit 1 or the 6s or 7s. Which goes in line with my argument that G and F loves archery hunters, just as long as they don't kill anything.

#5 Nontypical183

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From what I just read on the new rule making three items were not included water,salt or salt based products for the livestock industry,

#6 Coues 'n' Sheep

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From what I just read on the new rule making three items were not included water,salt or salt based products for the livestock industry,


I think if you read more closely it states that Ranchers can place salt, but we cant take game on it or place it... the language of the "rule change" is just vague enough that it is going to left up to how each WM personally reads it... infact some of the wording could even alow you to get a ticket for cameras, ground blinds or other items if placed on water and is determined to deter game... this rule change leaves the door WIDE open for more!
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#7 JLW

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imagine that... more grey areas?????????????

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#8 Coues Sniper

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G and F loves archery hunters, just as long as they don't kill anything.

I fixed your quote for you. G&F has been doing anything possible to lower ANY hunting success rates. Archery or otherwise. More tags means more $$$, and the only way to sell more tags is with lower success rates. Bottom line.

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#9 654321

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from the stats printed in the 2012 hunt az book looks to me hunt success for rifle has remained pretty consistent from 2007 to 2011, bottom line

#10 Coues Sniper

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They've been at it for a while now. Longer than 5 years.

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#11 520HUNT

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from the stats printed in the 2012 hunt az book looks to me hunt success for rifle has remained pretty consistent from 2007 to 2011, bottom line


If the AZ Game & Fish department will make up facts and use junk science to push the baiting ban thru, who's to say that they haven't been lying to us for the past few years by fudging the hunt success numbers and wildlife surveys? I smell a rat, and don't trust them anymore. I have heard some inside rumors that this has been going on for sometime now.
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#12 ThomC

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Did you notice the scientific reports at the end of the rulemaking post. I will bet that not very many of you will read up on the science. And if you do you wont understand it. Just call it "junk science" because you cant or dont want to understand it.

#13 mpriest

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from the stats printed in the 2012 hunt az book looks to me hunt success for rifle has remained pretty consistent from 2007 to 2011, bottom line


If the AZ Game & Fish department will make up facts and use junk science to push the baiting ban thru, who's to say that they haven't been lying to us for the past few years by fudging the hunt success numbers and wildlife surveys? I smell a rat, and don't trust them anymore. I have heard some inside rumors that this has been going on for sometime now.


AGFD doesn't make these number up. They are based on the hunter survey cards that every one with a tag gets. Its the people who don't fill them out or lie on them that fudges the numbers up.

#14 birddogg21

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This is off the G&F website under "Facts Behind Proposed Baiting Prohibition"?????? Looks like salts are going to be ok!


What is “bait”?

For the purposes of this rulemaking, the Commission considers bait to include any food-stuff or ingestible material that has been deposited, scattered, piled, or delivered by a passive or active feeder or feed delivery system so as to constitute an attractant, lure or enticement to wildlife and to influence the movement of these animals for the purpose of harvest by hunters.
“Bait” does not include:
  • Water
  • Salt or salt-based materials produced and manufactured for the livestock industry
  • Nutritional supplements produced and manufactured for the livestock industry and placed during the course of livestock or agricultural operations
  • Decoys
  • Scent lures provided they do not contain cervid urine
  • Chemical attractants provided they are not ingestible
  • Food plots planted within accepted local or regional agricultural guidelines


#15 Coues 'n' Sheep

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This is off the G&F website under "Facts Behind Proposed Baiting Prohibition"?????? Looks like salts are going to be ok!


What is “bait”?

For the purposes of this rulemaking, the Commission considers bait to include any food-stuff or ingestible material that has been deposited, scattered, piled, or delivered by a passive or active feeder or feed delivery system so as to constitute an attractant, lure or enticement to wildlife and to influence the movement of these animals for the purpose of harvest by hunters.
“Bait” does not include:

  • Water
  • Salt or salt-based materials produced and manufactured for the livestock industry
  • Nutritional supplements produced and manufactured for the livestock industry and placed during the course of livestock or agricultural operations
  • Decoys
  • Scent lures provided they do not contain cervid urine
  • Chemical attractants provided they are not ingestible
  • Food plots planted within accepted local or regional agricultural guidelines


In other words "You" can't put it out... The words are there and they are how you read them... Grey areas....
"Aim Small.....Miss Small"

"Don't Throw Stones In A Glass House!"

FUGGETABOUT IT!!!!!

Yes....I....Am!

Lets get Bloody!!!!!


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