Sportsmans Input Sought by ConserveandProtectAZ.org-Unit wide Raffle and Auction Tags

[joe hunter]

NO TAG GRAB IN ARIZONA !!!!!!!!! If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...... A friend of mine has been faithfully putting in for elk for 16 years and now has 17 points and still has never drawn an elk tag and these jokers want to put at least 200 privileged hunters ahead of him ? Go to Utah.

 

http://kutv.com/news/local/allegations-of-corruption-surround-utah-hungtin-and-conservation-expo

[AZkiller]

Guys I just interviewed Pete Cimellaro of ConserveandProtectAZ.org again (Episode 426) and asked him questions specifically from the questions you guys listed above. Give it a listen as I believe you will gain some more understanding of what they are proposing and why they are doing so. I tried to ask as many specific questions as time would allow.

 

Links to the episode 423, 424 and 426 Jay Scott Outdoors Podcast

 

For IOS and Apple users, https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/jay-scott-outdoors-western/id970694987?mt=2

 

For Android and PC users, http://jayscottoutdoors.podbean.com/?source=pb

 

Please send comments and questions to info@conserveandprotectaz.org

Thanks for doing this Jay

[azelkhunter2]

33 send me an e mail with contact info. I will find out what is available to you and put you in touch with the right individual. azdeer1@cox.net

Thanks Dave

[n2horns]

Any auction on tags, leads to an elitist level of hunting. All the talk is about hunter recruitment, education and retention, auctioning tags is just the opposite to that and will drive away hunters.

 

This will choke out the average income hunter to not be able to hunt and becomes a cash game of pay to play.

 

I am in no way in support of auctioning tags to the highest bidder.

[The Last Wood]

I appreciate you doing these podcasts and getting information out. Yes I heard how long you have known Pete and the respect you have for him, but is it typical to answer your own questions before letting him give his answer?

 

Not saying he is being dishonest, but when you frame questions like that it is very easy for someone to give the answer you want to hear.

 

I feel Pete is authentic and wants to help but I still don't see how auctioning off state resources for political action is ethical.

 

And when you asked if their goal was achieved would they consider giving some of the allowed tags back, that will never happen. When does anyone ever give up power or reaources.

[rossislider]

I've been trying to sit back and hear/read as many perspectives as possible over the past few days before formulating an opinion. As sportsmen and conservationist, who can be very passionate about these issues, I strongly feel we need to be very deliberate in taking a position, and that it is our responsibility to make sure we learn about and strive to understand all perspectives in this process. Ive listened to the podcasts and read everything I can in here, on Facebook (including Conserve and Protect Arizonas page) and have spoken with quite a few people.

 

First, I am appreciative of the members of Conserve and Protect Arizona and their role in fighting the HSUS. For that, the group has my gratitude. But gratitude will never equate to blind support for any organization. My gut reaction is to be skeptical of anyone looking to take tags away from our draw system for any type of sale, especially if they will be sold in a manner where any one person has an advantage (in this case wealth) over another. It is the proposed auctioning of these tags that I have trouble with.

 

From everything I know and have heard THUS FAR, I think I could get on board with a clearly defined and determined number of RAFFLE tags with capped purchases on those raffle tickets. Raffle tags could not be transferred beyond immediate family. The number of tags would have to be determined beforehand as would hunt times, weapon, species, sex, etc. These tags and this number could not be altered in any way or by any groups or individuals at any time without going through public hearings, votes, etc.

 

I have yet to hear or read anything that could even come close to getting me to support the auctioning of any of these tags. As long as this is on the table, I cant see any way that this initiative will gain the support of the average sportsman. Additionally, in listening to the podcasts, I feel that those pushing for this initiative over stress the raffle aspects of this but only mention auction tags in quick short almost whispered utterances, as if they are hiding from it and trying to keep attention away from it. This concerns me.

[bonecollector]

 

The only thing that will come from this is the rich will line their pockets with tags and the executives will line their pockets with money. I know we are beating a dead horse but ask the 99% of Utah hunters how they feel about an identical situation. Like we have said, G&F issues 100,000+ tags a year. You figure there have to be 500,000 applications to receive those tags. Add a $5-$10 conservation fee per application dedicated to the cause and it would raise far more money than these auction/raffle tags will. Sneaky Pete saying that that wouldnt raise the necessary funds is a flat out lie. Also saying that he doesnt want to place a financial burden on all hunters is a flat out lie. An extra $5-$10 would not reduce the amount of applicants by any measurable amount.

Aaaannnd again the G&F can't raise ANY money for political purposes.

 

 

 

The only thing that will come from this is the rich will line their pockets with tags and the executives will line their pockets with money. I know we are beating a dead horse but ask the 99% of Utah hunters how they feel about an identical situation. Like we have said, G&F issues 100,000+ tags a year. You figure there have to be 500,000 applications to receive those tags. Add a $5-$10 conservation fee per application dedicated to the cause and it would raise far more money than these auction/raffle tags will. Sneaky Pete saying that that wouldnt raise the necessary funds is a flat out lie. Also saying that he doesnt want to place a financial burden on all hunters is a flat out lie. An extra $5-$10 would not reduce the amount of applicants by any measurable amount.

Aaaannnd again the G&F can't raise ANY money for political purposes.

So, how is the g&f donating these tags and receiving money in return any different? If the money raised by raffle/auction tags goes back to g&f? How is that any different? If the people that are for this BS tag grab werent so condescending they would have a better chance. All the guys that are so for it act like us opposed are just a bunch of slack jawed, uneducated hillbillies that dont know what is good for us. Heres a box of crayons. Spell it out. Maybe well be able to make some sense out of it now

I have no idea actually. I'm not an attorney or a bureaucrat or politician. All I know is that they are not able to raise money for political purposes. Doesn't make any sense to me either.

According to Pete these funds will be strictly for educational purposes not politics. So if he isnt lying about that, there is no need for this extra group of people pimping our tags to the wealthy. G&F can raise the funds through some kind of stamp for education.

[GreyGhost85]

I have already seen enough contradiction between Sneaky Pete and his supporters and us simple folk that i know this is a bad deal. Nothing different than the last run they had at our tags.

[QCwtAddict]

I have already seen enough contradiction between Sneaky Pete and his supports and us simple folk that i know this is a bad deal. Nothing different than the last run they had at our tags.

The only difference from last time is this time the timing was right to use hsus as an excuse. But while bragging about how they single handedly defeated hsus they conveniently forgot to mention hsus loosing their charity ratings and their CEO resigning because of a sexual harassment scandal.

[WhtMtnHunter]

Wait a minute. Let me see if I have this right.

 

CAPAZ spokesman stated "For the past year CAPAZ has been working to deny the HSUS signature gatherers from collecting the 151,000 + signatures they needed to qualify their initiative."

 

The past year.

 

However at least 2 of the CAPAZ members, Rich Williams VP and Charlie Kellly Treasurer, are also on the commissioner selection board. They are picking, or have picked, the commissioners(including one sworn in last month) that will basically be deciding the fate of this proposal. Am I the only one to see at least somewhat of a conflict of interest here? In the interest of ethics and transparency shouldn't they resign from one or the other position immediately, if not sooner?

 

https://www.azgfd.com/agency/commission/commission-board/

[trphyhntr]

I have already seen enough contradiction between Sneaky Pete and his supports and us “simple folk” that i know this is a bad deal. Nothing different than the last run they had at our tags.

 

 

I have already seen enough contradiction between Sneaky Pete and his supports and us simple folk that i know this is a bad deal. Nothing different than the last run they had at our tags.

The only difference from last time is this time the timing was right to use hsus as an excuse. But while bragging about how they single handedly defeated hsus they conveniently forgot to mention hsus loosing their charity ratings and their CEO resigning because of a sexual harassment scandal.

 

you guys are guys are making too much sense to me.

[QCwtAddict]

 

 

I have already seen enough contradiction between Sneaky Pete and his supports and us simple folk that i know this is a bad deal. Nothing different than the last run they had at our tags.

 

I have already seen enough contradiction between Sneaky Pete and his supports and us simple folk that i know this is a bad deal. Nothing different than the last run they had at our tags.

The only difference from last time is this time the timing was right to use hsus as an excuse. But while bragging about how they single handedly defeated hsus they conveniently forgot to mention hsus loosing their charity ratings and their CEO resigning because of a sexual harassment scandal.

you guys are guys are making too much sense to me.

Ha it's Friday night cut me some slack

[Delw]

Wait a minute. Let me see if I have this right.

 

CAPAZ spokesman stated "For the past year CAPAZ has been working to deny the HSUS signature gatherers from collecting the 151,000 + signatures they needed to qualify their initiative."

 

The past year.

 

However at least 2 of the CAPAZ members, Rich Williams VP and Charlie Kellly Treasurer, are also on the commissioner selection board. They are picking, or have picked, the commissioners(including one sworn in last month) that will basically be deciding the fate of this proposal. Am I the only one to see at least somewhat of a conflict of interest here? In the interest of ethics and transparency shouldn't they resign from one or the other position immediately, if not sooner?

 

https://www.azgfd.com/agency/commission/commission-board/

you havent seen anything yet, do you remember back in the day when that one women and her Rancher husband was in the commission or had something to do with that. they also started a CONSERVATION ORGANIZATION. they were dirty as the day was long and only cared about selling out land own tags. this was also during the USO debacle.

Cant remember her name but I know RINGER DOES. they are other ones that need to be watched very closely

[bonecollector777]

Wait a minute. Let me see if I have this right.

 

CAPAZ spokesman stated "For the past year CAPAZ has been working to deny the HSUS signature gatherers from collecting the 151,000 + signatures they needed to qualify their initiative."

 

The past year.

 

However at least 2 of the CAPAZ members, Rich Williams VP and Charlie Kellly Treasurer, are also on the commissioner selection board. They are picking, or have picked, the commissioners(including one sworn in last month) that will basically be deciding the fate of this proposal. Am I the only one to see at least somewhat of a conflict of interest here? In the interest of ethics and transparency shouldn't they resign from one or the other position immediately, if not sooner?

 

https://www.azgfd.com/agency/commission/commission-board/

Interesting. . Little bit scary if the same people appointing the people that decide are the some of the same people pushing this.

[twigsnapper]

Its very important that we have elk guys, sheep guys, deer guys, on the appointment committee. The last thing we want are folks with non big game agendas on that committee. If the C&P thing doesnt get off the ground, we dont want Tucson Cat lady appointing our commissioners. Thats an extreme example.. but.. Just my opinion.