Sportsmans Input Sought by ConserveandProtectAZ.org-Unit wide Raffle and Auction Tags

[AZkiller]

Yes I would like to see the video as well.

As would I

[idgaf]

 

This is my take from last nights meeting. Let me preface what I am about to say with there are some really good people with passion for wildlife and hunting on the ADA. I did not get that feeling some of the leaders of the board.

 

One of the things I do for work is negotiate deals, so many times when I ask a question I am not paying attention to what they say but how they react to the question/situation to get a more accurate answer of what they are really thinking. (in poker that would be called 'tells')

 

According to my interpretation of what this contingency is trying to do two things; one is education to the 70% of residents of Arizona that are neither for nor against hunting. Secondly, and more passionately they want to fight the HSUS.

 

According to them they want the tags for education only and to not fight the HSUS. I pushed them a little bit to see how much money they need for education of the non-hunters and finally they came up with an amount of 500-750k. Bruce came up with the idea of adding a 1.00 to hunting licenses to get that amount (534,000 hunting licenses were sold last year according to the elk guy) This was dismissed relatively quickly.

 

Their goal for the evening was to try to figure out how many tags the public would be comfortable with giving them so they can raise money for 'education' My take on this is, they do not just want the tags for money, they want the tags for the prestige of being able to allocate tags like their big brothers(elk society, arizona super raffle, antelope foundation). Because of ego, short of somebody handing them ten million dollars they are fixated on getting tags and as many as they can.

 

HSUS war chest number was thrown around many times and it was a number over 200,000,000. I find that very hard to believe that they would spend .1% of that to end lion hunting in AZ with how quickly they dropped out of the getting lion hunting on the ballot.

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Once again, in my opinion, they do not want alternatives to raising money for education which may or may not be needed. They want tags. I do not believe they have done the necessary research to quantify anything yet, but that's what these meeting could be used for and maybe some more studying of the numbers. Bruce brought up some very valid points that I would consider and am going to run with a little bit to raise the necessary capitol to move the 70% without an opinion to the hunting side.

 

I feel the super raffle guy has integrity, they elk guy may, but the ada guy I would not trust. my camera ran out of batteries about twenty minutes if you want to watch the first part, I can post on you tube.

 

Also they made mention that AZFWC is no more and has been disbanded, but I did see a few Freudian slips from the ADA guy in regards to AZFWC so you be the judge.

idgaf - The main obstacle at this stage is how those funds can be used. If AZGFD generates them in any form, through the current donation channel (as I suggested), stamps, you name it... they will earmark those funds to a general fund. This concept sounds great until we consider what that really means - new trucks, larger PC monitors, fancier decorations, blah blah blah. Isn't that just more of the same ol' lame ol' government gross mismanagement of funds? Who's in for that? Not me. SO, this is where it gets interesting and where the conversation has actually turned a corner.

 

As mentioned in my previous post and to your point as well; yes many of the members at the meeting did not give you the impression that they had much intention of working hard to come up with alternatives. BUT, this is where WE come in to play. These folks are clearly a bit tired of only hearing from hunters when someone sounds the bell and the mob comes running. The very same people who go back to their lives and leave these evil board members to go back to doing all of dirty work we reap rewards from i.e. water tanks being repaired, water hauled, fences mended, and on and on... This group is clearly not getting younger (no offense intended here) and there is NOBODY in line to help fill the void.

 

The more I understand, the less I believe it's about the tags. I could be flat ars wrong. But I don't think so. These people need help, they need fresh ideas, and they need your help to hound the H E DOUBLE HOCKEY STICKS out of the AZGFD reps to figure out a different way to get this job done. If we don't ride this out and get our hands dirty, they are going to get the job done the best they see fit AND we will just have to live with the results.

 

I am with you and I will do the research this weekend when some of my work stuff gets out of the way. The idea that I would pitch is a separate line item on your hunting and fishing license like they have for search and rescue in Colorado (or the 911 fee on you phone bill) that way they can easily define the monies for education.

[elkaholic]

azkiller azelkhunter2

Please revel your names and the organizations your are involved with and the positions you hold

 

I like to know whom i'm talking to

 

Gary Hanson

 

ok I see dave vice pres ADA

 

what was your position with the ADA at the last tag steal attempt

[idgaf]

 

Idgaf...that was Jim unmacht who is not with the ADA...He is on the board of conserve and protect...

Please edit your previous post I absolutely dont need miss information on the inter web...Thanks Dave

From what Im told he was one of the originators of the first tag grab.

 

I would not trust him with a javelina tag in 25m to auction. He made mention AZSFWC is no more. Play the game GOOGLE THIS Jim Unmacht --and their face book page just posted something an hour or two ago.

[Delw]

I thought Jim ran the big horn sheep group? I've heard good things about him if its the same guy I am thinking

 

but he is (read below) 2017 article

 

 

 

Jim Unmacht, executive director of Arizona Sportsmen for Wildlife Conservation, said the mountain lion population is rebounding and other big cat species like jaguars and ocelots are protected under federal law.

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/arizona/articles/2017-09-27/activists-seek-ban-on-sport-hunting-of-arizona-big-cats

[wapitibob]

Pretty obvious it's all about the tags and their revenue. Same players, same line of bull crap. If it wasn't about the tags there'd be other options on the table being discussed.

[azelkhunter2]

Gary...I was relatively new to the organization at that time....( a new board member still in my first term )....I believe Allen Taylor if he is still around can verify the next part as he and I spoke at great length or I know Amanda and I had more then one conversation as to our position. I then like now see the need for a reliable funded source to fight the antis....But I was vocal in my dislike of the way it was being pushed through and the vagueness of the document I read....Way to much room for abuse...I spent many yrs as a union trustee and my job was to dissect city contracts and find ways to use them in employees benefit...I could have done virtually anything with the way this document was written.....And I let it be known.....Then like today I was not and am not a fan of additional auction tags....I see the revenue they can generate but until someone can show me beyond a shadow of a doubt that there is absolutely no other way....It will be hard to get behind....We as sportsman are not an unintelligent group when pressed there is not a lot we cant accomplish....It is my sincere hope that someone....anyone finds another funding source....I will say this I have no hidden agenda!!!!!....I have no issues saying what I believe and I dont expect everyone or anyone to always agree but thats what makes the country great...We all have the right to are own thoughts and opinions. Im almost 50 I am fortunate enough to have a wife and two grown kids that all love hunting and everything that the outdoors have to offer...I hope to someday have grandkids that I can hunt with....I just hope there is something left to hunt.....If you feel you need more information feel free to ask away.....

[125coues]

I would also love to see the video as it is hard for me to go to any of these meetings living in northern Arizona.Thanks to all who are going and posting up the info from the meetings.

[AZkiller]

azkiller azelkhunter2

Please revel your names and the organizations your are involved with and the positions you hold

 

I like to know whom i'm talking to

 

Gary Hanson

 

ok I see dave vice pres ADA

 

what was your position with the ADA at the last tag steal attempt

Haha I'm Dave Hallof and not involved with any club other than I am a new sustaining member of ada and 5year member of adbss. I hold no seat

[AZkiller]

Oh and I'm not rich

[idgaf]

https://youtu.be/npD4i1X4ofM

 

29 minutes of the meeting

[ThomC]

https://youtu.be/npD4i1X4ofM

 

29 minutes of the meeting

blank, was it held in a dark room?

[AZkiller]

https://youtu.be/npD4i1X4ofM

 

29 minutes of the meeting

Yeah doesn't work

[trophyseeker]

FWIW:

 

 

http://sportsafield.com/telling-our-story/

 

Telling Our Story

 

By: Diana Rupp

 

Hunters in two states are funding pro-hunting public relations campaigns in an effort to beat the antis at their own game.

 

Back in the 1990s, hunters in Colorado were smarting from a series of anti-hunting ballot initiatives that had recently passed in their state, including one that banned spring bear hunting. A few of them realized that the majority of the voting public didn’t know squat about hunting’s contributions to wildlife management and conservation, nor about the positive impact that hunting has on the economy.

 

They saw that public sentiment was being shaped by media campaigns run by well-funded anti-hunters and decided it was time to strike back with a PR campaign of their own. These sportsmen banded together with a mission to develop an ongoing media-based program to educate the urban, non-hunting public about the scientific, economic, and conservation benefits of hunting and fishing.

 

 

In a recent article (http://sportsafield.com/hug-a-hunter/), I wrote about what those forward-thinking Coloradoans came up with—legislation establishing a Wildlife Council with a long-term funding mechanism, via a license surcharge, fully dedicated to a pro-hunting mass-media campaign. This resulted in the “Hug a Hunter” ads you might have seen if you’ve been in Colorado recently—friendly, pro-hunting ads geared toward the non-hunting public that run on regular TV and radio channels and appear on billboards.

 

Watch them at https://hugahunter.com/watch-our-videos

 

This proactive public education program has transformed the hunting landscape in Colorado. Since the “Hug a Hunter” campaign has been running, surveys show that seven out of ten people say they would vote against any new hunting restrictions—a huge change from the 1990s. Further, 30 percent of non-hunters say they are more supportive of sportsmen than they were before they saw the ads. And perhaps most important, since the campaign started, not a single anti-hunting ballot measure has been introduced in Colorado.

 

Alan Taylor of Michigan, a successful businessman and avid hunter, heard about the Colorado program and thought it was such a good idea he decided to launch a similar initiative in his home state. He formed a group called The Nimrod Society to do just that, and they were successful. In 2013, Michigan governor Rick Snyder signed legislation establishing a surcharge of $1 per hunting and fishing license as a dedicated fund for a PR campaign aimed at educating Michigan’s urban, non-sporting public about the benefits of hunting, fishing, and wildlife management. The Council hired a professional ad agency and launched its own pro-sportsman PR campaign (see it at https://hereformioutdoors.org/

“That’s two states down, forty-eight more to go,” said Taylor.

 

Think about it: If hunters and anglers could get pro-hunting PR campaigns like Colorado’s and Michigan’s started in every state, it could make a huge difference in ensuring the future of wildlife populations and our hunting heritage. Best of all, there is now a proven model in place, and The Nimrod Society is eager to help sportsmen in other states start a program of their own. Learn more at https://nimrodsociety.org/

[wapitibob]

And look, no tags getting pulled from joe6pack and auctioned off. imagine that....