COOSEFAN

That looks like it was a lot of work skinnin' and cuttin'. Looks like an incredible hunt, with great bulls! Congrats to everyone!!!

That's a good point about the cost of everything else in our lives! I actually have relatives and friends that work for AZGFD and I remember asking my uncle about the deer tags. They had just done a survey( 2 years ago ) with several resources, ground and air, of the deer in unit 4B ( I'm almost positive it was for 4A also). They had observed a total of 63 deer and 3 of those were fawns! Yet they still issued a huge amount of tags! They have a system that figures in the deer they didn't count and go off that, but still issue even more tags to keep the general public happy! My uncle said they don't want an uproar from the general public from reducing tags. He said, they can't just shut an area down because of the backlash from the poeple that are more concerned about getting a tag than the welfare of the herd. These same poeple then complain about not seeing any deer on their hunt! The AZGFD has a lot of things to deal with, that we usually don't see or understand, but overall tend to do what the general public wants. As for the lion hunters, your right! They need to make life a little easier for them and keep it out of the public eye! It's amazing how many lions are actually out there today! In unit 10 and 9 on the late hunt last week alone, my guides, hunters and friends together saw 9 lions!!!!!!!!!! 6 lions in unit 10 and 3 lions in unit 9. 4 lions running together in 10 and 2 together in unit 9. I'm in the process of aquiring the photos for this site, but my brothers client photographed a big lion eating his elk quarter hanging in a tree at less than 30 yrds last week! The lions are a big problem and need to be delt with! Sorry for ramblin' or gettin' off subject. Thanks JIM

" there's always a way". It sucks, but we'll find a way to continue doin' what we love. Change is inevitable, but we'll work through it. More importantly, setting cost aside, I hope there's at least hunting opportunities still available to our kids in the future. BTW, I've spent close to $ 4,000.00 in gas since July 05". Thats all on hunting and scouting, that SUCKS. (appearently so does my V-10)

This is definitely a depressing issue, and one which affects all of us to different degrees. Depending on the importance you, as an individual, place on hunting, and more importantly your financial stability in life, this issue will affect everyone in different ways. To most, this is definitely going to make it harder for us to afford to do what we've done our whole life. I hate change, but it's going to happen no matter what, It sucks! I make a living 6 months out of the year from guiding, and NR clients are the bread and butter of the biz. With the cost of expenses, gas,gas,gas.........and food, I had to raise prices to stay afloat. With this new increase, on top of my own, it will definitely be harder to get clients willing to pay that much more. It will definitely create a "rich man's" sport for NR to hunt here. And the worst part is, I'm making less $ and having to pay more $ to hunt for myself in my own state! That sucks, but I'll do it, it'll be hard, but there's always a way! I personally know of several guys who will not be putting there mom, dad, sister, brother and family dog in for the draw this year because of increases, so there will be a few extra tags around for those who really want to hunt! ( maybe a silver lining?!?) thanks, JIM

Hey Couesnut, just returned home from wife's Kiabab hunt.....the sage flats are 1,170 grains heavier, and there are five very respectable bucks better educated!!! As for Mexico, I'm using Chihuahua Rough Country Outfitters. I met a guy at a R.M.E.F. banquet this year who had donated a coues hunt. I lost the tag in the auction and bought the only other tag he had left. I didn't have a choice on hunt dates, thats why I was curious about the rut intensity and what to expect at that certain time of Jan. I wish I could say that I researched this outfitter and the gentleman I met at the banquet before I signed on but I didn't. The guy I met is a respected guide and outfitter, and works side by side with the owner of C.R.C.O. down in Mex. The person who bought his donated hunt last year shot a 117" buck that jumped out while they were stalking a supposed 130" class buck! That guy was there at the banquet and highly recommended these guys. I don't know the specifics on the new lease, I just know it hasn't been guided on except the one time, with a 130" class buck shot by one of the Cabelas' boys. To tell the truth, I've dreamed of hunting Mex. Coues for a long time and didn't want to spend the money to go shoot a 80" -90" class buck. Don't get me wrong, thats huge in my book, but I feel thats something a guy, who has a good tag and does his homework, can kill here in AZ for a lot less money. This outfitter actually told me I will probably see a 100" plus buck every day and stand a good chance of seeing a 120" plus during the hunt if I hold out!!! Thats sounds unreal to me, but I saw the pic's and heard the references. I have always heard other outfitters say that 90" inches is what they shoot for and maybe 100" plus. So I felt now's the time to take a chance and try these guys out. I want to experience what I've always heard about, glassing and seeing SEVERAL 80-90" inch plus bucks every day and hopefully a few 100" inch plus bruisers mixed in. Just to do that and come home empty handed would be fine with me, but if I bring one home, I want it to be something special, a lot of character, mass, extras, or just plain huge! Any Coues buck, regardless of size, gets me excited, but this hunt is a bonus hunt this year for me so I'm holding out for THE ONE! I'm meeting my American outfitter at the border, then driving in with him, I will take my optics and thanks for the reasurrance. I will finally have time this week to talk with the outfitter about the rest of the details. "Is there any questions I should ask, things I need to know I'm not already aware of?" "What was Ernesto C talking about reporting a trophy to PROFEPA or USFWS?" Thanks for everyones advice, sorry for typing so much, been away for a while! ONE LAST THING, is there a link between my outfitter and EL Halcon? On "COUES DEER IS KING" they tried to cut out parts where poeple say the name but they were calling themsleves "Rough Country Outfitters" also? It's had me confused for a while. They didn't say "CHIHUAHUA Rough C.O." just "Rough C.O." maybe thats the difference? If you have any bad news about my Outfitter, please don't tell me, I've already paid!!! Thanks again, JIM

I have a question regarding top side tail color on Coues. I have a grandfather who grew up in Tucson hunting coues. and he swears that there is two types of Coues. One a "Red-Tail coues" and the other just a regular coues. He states the the "Red-Tail" lives close to the border in the southern units. I always just humored him but lately have noticed that there are differences in tail color. I just killed one by Arivaca and it had a bright orangeish-red tail that actually looked out of the ordinary. The taxidermist had one from unit 31 that had a very salt and pepper color with no browns or reds on it's tail!? What actually creates these differences in tail color? I've noticed small differences in coues color in different age classes and even region or elevation but only in the face and general hide coloration. Why such a drastic difference in top-side tail color? Hopefully someone knows and I'm not just crazy! Jim

Talk about being repectful to your animal in a kill photo! That might be overdoing it!! JK. Awesome buck and photos! Congrats! JIM

Welcome to the site, I'm fairly new here also and the members here are very knowledgeable and are always willing to help out. I have killed several mulies with a bow and have put more time in to getting a whitey with a bow and haven't yet. If you are just wanting to get a deer under your belt with a bow, then mulies will give you the best chances, in my opinion. I feel they aren't as hard to stalk, not as wary and don't jump strings as fast, and not to mention a bigger target. I would suggest being extremely confident with your bow out to at least 40 yrds, hunt spot and stalk mulies throughout the December hunt, and hunt spot and stalk cousies every chance you get throughout Jan. You'll learn more than you could imagine just being out there doing it. The main key is "PATIENCE" on the stalk! If you want a big buck of either specie, especially coues, then patterning and sitting the pattern whether it's a tank, salt, or a trail is your best bet, but this is more of an early season tactic. The bucks move around very randomely during the rut, following and chasing does, but they still need to drink and will follow does to water. Alot of time and effort goes into making this work and the rewards can be outstanding! Best of luck to you! JIM

My outfitter is a guide here in the states and works with a Mexican affiliate for the mexico stuff. Our schedules clash due to the very busy guiding season, so I haven't gone over the fine details of the hunt yet. All my info for my equipment and gun permit have already been taken care of and I've already got my passport taken care of. We are supposed to go over the details when I return from my wifes 12aw hunt on Sun. These late elk hunts have been hectic to say the least. No, I have never guided in Mexico, and have never even been there. My hunt is a 6 day hunt and I believe I'll be hunting full days for those 6 and driving on the 7th and 8th days of my trip. As for "Self-Guided", I believe there will be a guy with us to tell us good places to go and help out, but I'm getting a deal on this hunt becuase it's a new lease and no facilities. The outfitter knows us ( my brother is going to video tape) and figured we would be good clients to try out this new ranch. If the ranch isn't producing, we have the option to hunt the other leases. I was hoping you would say that this is a good time to go, it just seems late to me, but I wouldn't know. I appreciate everyones input, thanks JIM

Great story! I could feel the emotions just reading it! Congrats!

On the subject of lions, My brother had a successful unit 9 client sitting about 30 yrds from his skinned and quartered bull while he went for the truck yesterday. A lion walked up to a hind quarter and started eatin'. The hunter( from CA) started taking pic's then stood up and yelled at it. The cat charged forward about 5 yards to him. The hunter threw the camera down and started screaming and throwing rocks at it to finally make it leave. I think I would have been pointing a rifle instead of a camera, but I wouldn't have gotten it all on film either. This happened yesterday AM and was too close to the park fence to bring in the dogs. As soon as I can get my hands on the pic's, I'll post them. I guess he did take pic's of the cat in mid stride towards him!!! Glassed up a few cats already this year, here and in NM, I think there's quite a few out there!

I can't stop staring at that photo! That thing's a monster! The character on that buck is amazing!

Great buck and awesome pic's! Congrats!

Hey, I just noticed I finally lost my "Newbie" ranking! hoooray!

Thanks for all your replies, I still find it fascinating, and the biology pages are great. This is a question I've been afraid to ask for awhile, but now I'm glad I did, it seems like everyone has noticed it and have different ideas and they all sound logical. To Bronco, I thought the summer coat was an outer layer of longer, thinner hair, usually a lighter color, that was shed exposing the thicker, darker color winter coat. If this is the case, the deer I killed about a week ago, would have still been bright orange color after shedding. His tail was orange-red throughout down to the roots, with no white fringe, and no different color underlayer?! Do they actually grow a winter coat while shedding the summer coat?

Thanks for the replies, I think my favorite thing about this site is that it's not totally based on score. Thats probably due to the deer itself though, even a spike can be a great trophy to an individual, and you guys are great at promoting that in your replies back to members that post their pic's, regardless of size. Don't get me wrong though, my thoughts and dreams are of "book bucks","mass", and "droptines", but theres always something special about a coues, regardless of what it scores! To Chef, quite a few of our pic's end up in the "OUTDOORSMANS" magazine, "WESTERN HUNTER", and I have the habit of "Raising the Glass" for promotion reasons, plus, aside from my legs, my arsenal of "SWARO'S" are my greatest aset to hunting Couesies. To Deerslam, he does have some muley traits, he's the biggest bodied coues I've killed, and big ears, but he had the brightest orange colored tail I've ever seen. The size of his 2 point rack made me double check before the shot too! Thanks Again, Jim

I love that buck, mass, frame, and even color! Absolutely beautiful buck! I would definitly say 105" to 108". Congrats to you both!

Hey David, I had a client kill a nice bull on the late 5Bn hunt on Fri. and he's got a broken G5 on his right side. We can break that 14 inch extra off, and super glue it to his bull and both of your bulls will score 14 inches higher!!!!!!!!!! JK, I can't remember what I initially green scored your bull at, I'm curious how different it is now after the drying period? Someone else said it but I always use it, "NET'S ARE FOR FISH!" and give the animal credit for what he grew, but to make any book is always great, Congratulations again, Jimmy M.

Beautiful buck! I love his frame, and character! I would definitely say he's around 97-98", A tremendous buck. I know what you mean about sitting in front of the computer instead of being out there. I killed mine on Fri. morning and home by late Fri. night, couldn't pass it up. That's an awesome buck!

Congrats on your buck, thats such an awesome feeling to hunt harder than most and to be successful! My 36B hunt was very similar to yours and my Badlands 2200 pack came in very handy. I had my entire deer minus the rib cage and 2 pairs of binos, tripod, camera, pistol, and knives in and strapped to my Badlands 2200 pack. If you can carry it, it will hold it, I would definitely check the 2200 out. Great job again!

Thats one heck of a bull for 4B! Great bull and congrats!!!

Hey David, I was at Bret's house and I was the lucky person to first score your bull. After talking to you at the seminar I knew you were dedicated enough to accomplish what you've done, didn't surprise me! You did an awesome job on your own and tagged an incredible bull. My favorite is his G1's and have yet to put my hands on another bull with any as big as yours. Great job and Great bull David, talk to ya soon. Jimmy M.