Outdoor Writer

Where do you come with theses absurd & inane "facts?" I suppose next you'll tell us you know six guides who have been arrested for illegally taking game with items they wrote off.

Gotcha. I often have the same memory failures, and it seems to be getting worse every day. 😂

That it might no longer be dire today.

It's from 2004, though.

I tried searching for a lion study with no luck. Below is the only thing concerning the Eagletails in the PDF I already cited. Eagletail Mountains The desert bighorn sheep population in the Eagletail Mountains was extant, but static, with a very low density of 35 individuals. The desert bighorn sheep had access to natural water, a known death trap, and a quasi-perennial spring that was also used by livestock. One water source was renovated in 1989, 1 was constructed in 1990, and another was enlarged and renovated in 1996. In 1984, biologists released a total of 16 desert bighorn sheep into this area. A survey in 1994 revealed 35 bighorn sheep. A total of 75 were found in 1997—the same year that 10 were removed for translocation. In October of 2000, 160 desert bighorn sheep were found in this area and an additional translocation of 25 animals occurred. The most current survey conducted in 2003 revealed 99 observations of bighorn sheep.

This might be the PDF? Wildlife Water Developments and Desert Bighorn Sheep in the Southwestern United States An excerpt: Arizona Catchment #933 During a routine inspection in June of 2000, 12 inches of water was found in catchment #933, a 15-year old water structure in western Arizona. In August of 2000, AGFD officials inspected that same water catchment and found it was dry. They observed a class II desert bighorn sheep ram in poor physical condition bedded near the storage tank, a dead class IV ram, a dead mature mule deer buck, and a dead coyote lying near the tank. In addition, 3 class I rams, 1 class III ram, 4 ewes, a male and female yearling, 1 lamb, and 1 mule deer were alive inside the tank. There were also 2 dead mule deer inside the tank. The fish and wildlife officials provided 4 gallons of water to the animals inside the tank, which was immediately consumed by the bighorn sheep. The officials radioed headquarters for water hauling, and dismantled a portion of the tank to allow the animals to escape. They noted that the wildlife found dead in and around the tank appeared to have died from dehyhdration. They also suspected that the wildlife had jumped into the tank to consume the remaining 2 inches of water left in the tank after the float-regulated drinker went dry. The ungulates were able to jump into the tank from higher elevations, but would not or could not leave the tank after entering. The size of the antlers on the mule deer and horns of the desert bighorn ram found outside the tank likely prevented them from entering the narrow opening into the tank. The site was revisited 56 days later in October of 2000 when temperatures were still reaching the low 100s. There was 2 feet of water in the tank. A dead adult bighorn ewe was observed 0.5 miles northeast of the tank, and was estimated to have died that summer. Numerous deer pellets representing deer of all age classes were observed on trails around the catchment. There was no evidence of recent browse on cacti near or within 0.5 miles of the catchment. Catchment #933 met its objective to provide a permanent water source for a new herd introduced to the northern portion of the Plomosa Mountains. The nearest water source from the catchment is about 7.5 miles to the southeast through mostly contiguous habitat. Additional long-term monitoring of the catchment will provide further insight regarding its dependency to desert bighorn sheep. Lazarus Tank In July of 1979, Witham (1982) found a dead 9-year old ram and 5 visibly dehydrated live desert bighorn sheep near Lazarus Tank in the Plomosa Mountains. A necropsy indicated that the ram was in fairly good physical condition with substantial body fat in the abdominal cavity. However, the light weight of the ram suggests it was suffering from dehydration. Five days later, a hiker found a dead 3-year old ram at the same dry water source. On July 21, 5 mature rams were found dead in a cave 1.75 miles northwest of the site. The rams showed signs of recent rutting activity, and appeared to have died at about the same time as the 9-year old ram found near the watering hole. A nearby tinaja had also gone dry. The nearest permanent water source is 41 years old and located about 4 miles north/northeast through contiguous habitat. Numerous succulent cacti were available in the area.

Outstanding! Then you should show your mother and/or wife how intelligent you are by calling them a c_ _ _. That should raise your IQ quite a bit. It might even raise a welt or two. By the way, that so-called study took in a much broader scope of words than just plain ol' obscenities. It also included slurs and perjoritives. In any case, such language apparently failed to produce the fluency that supposedly results from an extensive gutter word vocabulary as witnessed by the sometimes incoherent ramblings of a few here.

Indeed. Even learned that a question should have a ? at the end rather than a comma. Apparently, you played hookey that day.

You didn't have to waste time typing that to establish your status as an idiot. That was done long ago. Even the dictionary has been updated to show it.

For shame. This from someone that writes as if English is your second language. One of my college lit professors once told us that people who can't express themselves without using some form of the F-word usually have an IQ that's just barely above idiot level. It's not tough sounding, nor does it make one right. Instead, it's just plain ignorant & self-degrading. She was dead-on as far you're concerned.

The regs don't say it. Salt is legal on both private & public land.

I just said that, as in "Until AGFD changes the rule in some way to prevent the actual fakers from doing the same, it will be that way" or for anyone, this whole discussion about this issue is moot. And the first things the commissioners will ask are the same questions I've been asking to determine if there is an actual problem that needs solving. Now, I'm shutting down for night. I gotta go help my bride cook dinner.

It's legal for a person has that type of disability to apply for whatever type hunt he wants and it's also legal for him to apply for a crossbow permit if qualified for one. Until AGFD changes the rule in some way to prevent the actual fakers from doing the same, it will be that way. Maybe they should rewrite the rule so they would need a note from Del rather than a medical professional. Then once they prevent all this crossbow skulduggery from taking place, they can do something about guys that draw too many elk permits.

I got my Rio(s) in Tx, Oscelola in FL., several easterns in different states -- MO, AL, OH & SC , Meriams(s) in AZ & CO and Gould's in Sonora.

I agree about the bad apples. That's the way it is with many things. 😉 I just don't think the fakers are as numerous as some think they are. As an aside...one doesn't have to look disabled to not be able to draw a bow. My youngest son ruined rotator in his right shoulder when he was in the Army 40 years ago and had a couple surgeries. He hasn't been able to draw a bow without major pain since. But if you see him or even watch him do other stuff with his right arm, you would never sense something is amiss with his shoulder.

There appears to be some confusion in regards to crossbow permits and CHAMPS permits. They are two different permits. A CHAMPS hunter, which relates to one's PERMANENT disability, has various benefits allowed such as shooting from a vehicle, etc. etc. It does NOT give the CHAMPS permit holder a dispensation to use a crossbow. Reason: because not all CHAMPS holders can't draw a bow. So like anyone else, the CHAMPS holder would have to apply for a crossbow permit if drawing a bow is a problem. So you're saying you drew archery bull elk permits from 2013 to 2017?? That's would be outstanding luck for Unit 8. NOW...were these half-dozen that you personally observed CHAMPS permit holders using crossbows, legitimate crossbow permit holders BEFORE they even applied or the alleged swappers you cited earlier? Lastly, if any were the alleged swappers, how do YOU know whether their injury or condition was legit and not bad enough where they couldn't draw a bow?

I didn't see anyone define the "swapping" you're talking about and assume you actually mean swapping for a crossbow permt and not "champ tags." So...since you want to go there and seem to have some vast amount of experience with it...if this "swapping" is so popular, perhaps you can put some sort of number on it. To get you kick started, in 2019, there were 5877 reg. archery elk permits, and 1701 elk were killed. How many dudes got drawn for one of those archery permits and THEN applied for a crossbow permit?? And I'll ask you the same question I asked prior: how many hunters overall have CHAMP permits? And how many of them have crossbow permits??

Omittted the nonessential. The point: it is not uncommon for you to send a thread off the rails with an irrelevant comment. I would guess a FOA request would provide the accurate CHAMP #s, while "anyone that spends much time on archery hunts has seen" is nothing more than hyperbole.

Wonder how that happened? 🙄

So enlighten everyone; just how many CHAMP hunters are there, and how many of them draw archery elk permits each year & use airbows?

ONLY those who can legally obtain a CHAMP crossbow permit for use during an "archery" season can use an airbow. All others are limited to using airbows during the general firearms season only. Except for CHAMP holders, airbows are also illegal for use during a HAM season for javelina.

Those inner teeth are indeed 'baby' teeth. An adult javelina has a total of 38 teeth. The lower jaw will have 20 -- 6 incisors in front of the 2 canines, 6 premolars & 6 molars behind the canines. The upper has 18 total, with 2 less incisors.

Man, you can almost complete another slam on that trip if you could get a Gould's somehere. It would be a FL osceola, eastern in about any of the eastern states you mentioned, likely Rio in OK, & a Meriam's in AZ. Maybe take a side trip into Mexico for an expensive Gould's?

Southern Arizona Wildlife Callers -- Monthly meetings are held at 7:00 P.M. the second Thursday of every month at the PSE Factory. 2727 N. Fairview Ave. Tucson, AZ 85705

My portal login is the NEW name & PW the new system put in place when AGFD sent out the email about the change being made. But it sounds like you're all set now. 👍