223 for Coues?

[youngbuck]

I went through the same thing with my daughter,and son.I had built a 223 rifle on a contenter frame.Single shot,have to pull the hammer back,ect. perfect!!The kids both killed pigs,and whitetails with it.Stay toward the heavier bullets-55Gr. on up,and shoot them in the chest.They moved up to a 243 at about 13,and killed 3 or 4 elk with 1 shot apiece.Good Luck,and let us know how they did.

 

 

Interesting post on the 243 for elk. Was it Cow hunt? My 14 year old has a cow tag I think he'll use my 270 but I had thought about getting a 243 but thought it was to light for elk. How far was the shot?

 

I also used a .243 w/ 100gr corelokts when I was 10 on a cow. 100yds, she took only a couple steps.

 

I would use a .223 for coues, not my first choice though. I've had a 223WSSM in camp as a buck up gun a few times. Ive got a buddy who wants to use his AR for a coues this year. If we both draw tags, he'll haul the AR, and I will haul one of my rifles. If a small kid is more comfortable shooting a smaller gun, that's what they should be shooting. When I was 10, the 25-06 recoil scared me, and the win m94 30-30 had a weird safety I couldn't get used to.

 

For ammo, it looks like federal loads a partition and a 64gr soft point. Keep the shot to a couple hundred yards or less, and it will do fine. I would choose something 60gr or heavier, depending what your rifle likes. I'm a big fan of Remington corelokt, the cheap pointed soft points. It looks like they don't make those in a .223.

[couesobsession]

A .223 isn';t the best choice for deer. that being said, however, broadside shots under 300 yards shouldn't be a problem. My family (not me) used to use a .222 caliber rifle for years and it always got the job done. A .222 is less powerfukl than a .223. I would also recommend a .243. You don't have to go all out, a rossi single shot .243 is well under $300 even when you buy it as a combo with the shotgun barrel. I've gotten 1 inch groups with it with premium ammo @ 100 yards when I useed one.

[billrquimby]

I shot maybe a dozen Texas Hill Country whitetails in the 1970s with a .22-250, and all were instant kills from 100 out to 300 yards with little meat damage, but my only experience with a .223 was in South Africa, where I was invited to shoot in an organized springbuck cull.

 

The shots were from 50 to 125 yards with a .223 and ammo provided by my host. The antelope were slowly pushed to us by guys on horseback and motorcycles. We shooters were instructed to kill every antelope that entered our killing zone, which was marked with flags.

 

There were maybe ten or twelve of us shooting, and by the second day we had killed maybe 300 or more springbuck. I didn't count how many I personally shot, but it was a bunch, and I definitely was not undergunned with a .223.

 

We were told to shoot our animals "in the box," meaning the heart-lung area, and not try for head, neck, or spine. Butchers in refrigerated trucks stood by to handle the carcasses and the meat was eventually sold as "venison" in Europe.

 

Almost forgot. I shot another springbuck with a .223 on a later trip. It was about 225-250 yards away, and it dropped in its tracks at the shot.

 

Your kids should do well with a .223. Just try to get them close.

 

Bill Quimby

[apache12]

I shot maybe a dozen Texas Hill Country whitetails in the 1970s with a .22-250, and all were instant kills from 100 out to 300 yards with little meat damage, but my only experience with a .223 was in South Africa, where I was invited to shoot in an organized springbuck cull.

 

The shots were from 50 to 125 yards with a .223 and ammo provided by my host. The antelope were slowly pushed to us by guys on horseback and motorcycles. We shooters were instructed to kill every antelope that entered our killing zone, which was marked with flags.

 

There were maybe ten or twelve of us shooting, and by the second day we had killed maybe 300 or more springbuck. I didn't count how many I personally shot, but it was a bunch, and I definitely was not undergunned with a .223.

 

We were told to shoot our animals "in the box," meaning the heart-lung area, and not try for head, neck, or spine. Butchers in refrigerated trucks stood by to handle the carcasses and the meat was eventually sold as "venison" in Europe.

 

Almost forgot. I shot another springbuck with a .223 on a later trip. It was about 225-250 yards away, and it dropped in its tracks at the shot.

 

Your kids should do well with a .223. Just try to get them close.

 

Bill Quimby

[apache12]

oops. still figuring this forum think out, meant to attach this reply to Bill.

 

Bill,

 

What a cool story about the Africa hunt, sounds like ot be fun to sit a campfire with you sometime and listen to some hunt stories. Think I'm going to have him hunt the 223 and just get him in close as can be had on a coues. He loves to shot it and he's confident, I think that's half the battle at his age. If I find a deal on a 243 before the hunt I'll move him up to it.

[billrquimby]

oops. still figuring this forum think out, meant to attach this reply to Bill.

 

Bill,

 

What a cool story about the Africa hunt, sounds like ot be fun to sit a campfire with you sometime and listen to some hunt stories. Think I'm going to have him hunt the 223 and just get him in close as can be had on a coues. He loves to shot it and he's confident, I think that's half the battle at his age. If I find a deal on a 243 before the hunt I'll move him up to it.

 

Apache12:

 

That's a good plan, but give him plenty of time to get used to the .243. For one thing, it's much louder than a .223, which is something parents often forget when introducing their kids to shooting. For another, the recoil (although insignificant for an adult) is nearly four times that of the .223.

 

Data I have shows the .223 with 55-grain bullets having 3.2 foot pounds of recoil energy. The .243 with 95-grain bullets has 11.0 ft. lbs of recoil energy, and that's quite a step up from what he has been shooting.

 

It really wasn't a hunt. It was a cull, and the corporation that owned the huge property and its wildlife made a party of its annual springbuck harvest by inviting business associates and friends to participate.

 

I was honored to have been invited, but I wouldn't want to do it again. We were instructed to kill every springbuck, no matter age or sex, that passed between our flags. It was catered, with lots of fancy food and libation after the morning and afternoon shoots, and fun was had by all, but it wasn't hunting.

 

Please excuse my crass commercial announcement, but you may enjoy reading my book, "Sixty Years A Hunter." It's $40 plus shipping and handling from Safari Press. I can send you an autographed copy for the same.

 

Bill Quimby

[billrquimby]

oops. still figuring this forum think out, meant to attach this reply to Bill.

 

Bill,

 

What a cool story about the Africa hunt, sounds like ot be fun to sit a campfire with you sometime and listen to some hunt stories. Think I'm going to have him hunt the 223 and just get him in close as can be had on a coues. He loves to shot it and he's confident, I think that's half the battle at his age. If I find a deal on a 243 before the hunt I'll move him up to it.

 

Apache12:

 

That's a good plan, but give him plenty of time to get used to the .243. For one thing, it's much louder than a .223, which is something parents often forget when introducing their kids to shooting. For another, the recoil (although insignificant for an adult) is nearly four times that of the .223.

 

Data I have shows the .223 with 55-grain bullets having 3.2 foot pounds of recoil energy. The .243 with 95-grain bullets has 11.0 ft. lbs of recoil energy, and that's quite a step up from what he has been shooting.

 

It really wasn't a hunt. It was a cull, and the corporation that owned the huge property and its wildlife made a party of its annual springbuck harvest by inviting business associates and friends to participate.

 

I was honored to have been invited, but I wouldn't want to do it again. We were instructed to kill every springbuck, no matter age or sex, that passed between our flags. It was catered, with lots of fancy food and libation after the morning and afternoon shoots, and fun was had by all, but it wasn't hunting.

 

Please excuse my crass commercial announcement, but you may enjoy reading my book, "Sixty Years A Hunter." It's $40 plus shipping and handling from Safari Press. I can send you an autographed copy for the same.

 

Bill Quimby

[apache12]

oops. still figuring this forum think out, meant to attach this reply to Bill.

 

Bill,

 

What a cool story about the Africa hunt, sounds like ot be fun to sit a campfire with you sometime and listen to some hunt stories. Think I'm going to have him hunt the 223 and just get him in close as can be had on a coues. He loves to shot it and he's confident, I think that's half the battle at his age. If I find a deal on a 243 before the hunt I'll move him up to it.

 

Apache12:

 

That's a good plan, but give him plenty of time to get used to the .243. For one thing, it's much louder than a .223, which is something parents often forget when introducing their kids to shooting. For another, the recoil (although insignificant for an adult) is nearly four times that of the .223.

 

Data I have shows the .223 with 55-grain bullets having 3.2 foot pounds of recoil energy. The .243 with 95-grain bullets has 11.0 ft. lbs of recoil energy, and that's quite a step up from what he has been shooting.

 

It really wasn't a hunt. It was a cull, and the corporation that owned the huge property and its wildlife made a party of its annual springbuck harvest by inviting business associates and friends to participate.

 

I was honored to have been invited, but I wouldn't want to do it again. We were instructed to kill every springbuck, no matter age or sex, that passed between our flags. It was catered, with lots of fancy food and libation after the morning and afternoon shoots, and fun was had by all, but it wasn't hunting.

 

Please excuse my crass commercial announcement, but you may enjoy reading my book, "Sixty Years A Hunter." It's $40 plus shipping and handling from Safari Press. I can send you an autographed copy for the same.

 

Bill Quimby

 

 

Bill,

 

Can I mail cash up to you for the book? I'm a UA grad and left UA in 91 for Army serivce maybe I read you in the paper. I read your bio on Wiki. Happy to meet you.

 

Chad

[Coach]

As always, this site is full of good people with good advice. If I can add a tidbit, the .223 is one of the easiest rounds for younger shooters - especially those groomed on rimfire rounds. Shot placement is vital though. A good hit with a .223 will drop anything from a jackrabbit to an elk (or larger as others have pointed out). A less-than-perfect hit with a .223 can easily lead to a lost animal, and with a youth hunter, that can be really tough.

 

I've got 3 boys all learning to hunt, and they all like shooting the AR, but I reserve that for only javelina. We don't have a .243, but it's a great all-around gun. If you compare the recoil of a .223 to a .243 it's pretty minimal compared to the actual energy of the bullets.

 

If your young hunter can put the bullet in just the right place in hunting conditions with the .223 and is not comfortable with anything bigger, then that is probably the right gun for them.

 

On the other hand, if they can shoot more gun, they should. A .243, 25-06, .270, on and on, are much better for deer sized game. My boys are not really "large-framed" but my 14 year old shoots my .300 WSM and my middle boy, 12 shoots a .270 WSM. Both are around 100 pounds wet and well fed. But if you compare a 55 grain .223 bullet to a 150 grain .270 bullet, there's no comparison at all.

 

Glad to see you getting a youth hunter in the field. When it comes to picking the right deer bullet for kids, I think the trade-off is what they can shoot accurately, vs. what is most effective. Given our range of great youth guns out there, I would put the .223 at the low end of the scale, and the .270 WSM or 7mm-08 at the upper end, and see what the kiddos can handle, and put the biggest stick in their hands that they can shoot comfortably.

 

Good hunting, and best wishes.

 

Coach

[apache12]

As always, this site is full of good people with good advice. If I can add a tidbit, the .223 is one of the easiest rounds for younger shooters - especially those groomed on rimfire rounds. Shot placement is vital though. A good hit with a .223 will drop anything from a jackrabbit to an elk (or larger as others have pointed out). A less-than-perfect hit with a .223 can easily lead to a lost animal, and with a youth hunter, that can be really tough.

 

I've got 3 boys all learning to hunt, and they all like shooting the AR, but I reserve that for only javelina. We don't have a .243, but it's a great all-around gun. If you compare the recoil of a .223 to a .243 it's pretty minimal compared to the actual energy of the bullets.

 

If your young hunter can put the bullet in just the right place in hunting conditions with the .223 and is not comfortable with anything bigger, then that is probably the right gun for them.

 

On the other hand, if they can shoot more gun, they should. A .243, 25-06, .270, on and on, are much better for deer sized game. My boys are not really "large-framed" but my 14 year old shoots my .300 WSM and my middle boy, 12 shoots a .270 WSM. Both are around 100 pounds wet and well fed. But if you compare a 55 grain .223 bullet to a 150 grain .270 bullet, there's no comparison at all.

 

Glad to see you getting a youth hunter in the field. When it comes to picking the right deer bullet for kids, I think the trade-off is what they can shoot accurately, vs. what is most effective. Given our range of great youth guns out there, I would put the .223 at the low end of the scale, and the .270 WSM or 7mm-08 at the upper end, and see what the kiddos can handle, and put the biggest stick in their hands that they can shoot comfortably.

 

Good hunting, and best wishes.

 

Coach

 

 

Hard to argue with any of that. I like the ballistics on the 7mm-08. I just have one small problem, not enough money for the guns I want. Don't even get me started on the Optics I need.