Flatlander Report post Posted May 14, 2018 ... and I have witnessed with my own eyes Cindi Richardson buy a raffle at a banquet by just flooding the bucket with her tickets. I didnt have a problem with it, I have a lot of respect for Corky and Cindy, but to say there is no advantage to the hunting elite is false.Oh geez, now I really feel like an idiot. Several years back at one of the banquets, they had a raffle for a black Lab pup. My wife really wanted it. So I bought $500 in tickets. If I knew that might negatively paint me as "the hunting elite," I would never have done such a dastardly deed without asking someone's permission on how I can spend my money. I'll know better next time. Oh, I didn't even win the dang raffle. I don't know for sure, but that pup might have gone to a homeless person -- i.e. not one of the "elite"--who could only afford one ticket. I did not say anything negative about the hunting elite. I have spent lots of money at banquets as well. I am all for the model, I just dont support using supply and demand as the model of extracting value from tags as it violates the North American model. I said nothing negative about Cindi or her family, I respect them very much. But Corky and Cindi are far from the regular guys that Red said always win the raffles. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
5guyshunting Report post Posted May 14, 2018 The supoorters know d@mn good and well that if they get one raffle tag it will very soon turn into a couple hundred raffles and a couple dozen auction tags. All they need is a foot hold. Its kinda like the 2nd ammendment battle. Do people really need full auto machines guns? Probably not. Would a few raffle tags kill us? Probably not. Like i have said before, it REALLY bothers me that Sneaky Pete is not even willing to listen to alternatives and that we as sportsmen are basically having to try to convince an outfit, that should not have ANY say in what is done with our tags in the first place, not to take them. The scary part is, last time they came at us, the commission was against it. This time, the commission is licking their chops at the idea. Isnt it weird that Sneaky Pete, amongst other CAPAZ members are on the commossioner appointing board? Isnt it wierd that Sneaky Pete always talks about million-dollar donors if this passes? Somebody is going to get rich off of this and it most definitely will not be Average Joe Hunter. Sneaky Pete must also be A.K.A. Slippery Peter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ringer Report post Posted May 14, 2018 I see the red man is here fighting for his masters again. I remember when Pete was hired by Don Peay. After the last tag grab failure and the mess in Alaska they suddenly said there was no financial connection between AZSFW and SFW. Really? You are just a plant by Pete and you know it. You talk about honor yet admitted to me that you posed as a journalist to befriend the HSUS top people and got all of their personal info. You certainly picked the right handle on here nefarious. I read an article from Alaska where Peay was bragging about getting "his" people to control G&F there. You can bet that has already started here. Show up at the June meeting and send RedPeter packing--again. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nefarious Red Report post Posted May 14, 2018 I see the red man is here fighting for his masters again. I remember when Pete was hired by Don Peay. After the last tag grab failure and the mess in Alaska they suddenly said there was no financial connection between AZSFW and SFW. Really? You are just a plant by Pete and you know it. You talk about honor yet admitted to me that you posed as a journalist to befriend the HSUS top people and got all of their personal info. You certainly picked the right handle on here nefarious. I read an article from Alaska where Peay was bragging about getting "his" people to control G&F there. You can bet that has already started here. Show up at the June meeting and send RedPeter packing--again.you're still uttering your nonsense. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elkaholic Report post Posted May 14, 2018 Those people whom "regularly" seem lucky at banquets, are usually spending 5 to 10 times what an average Joe can spend. I try to pick one a yr. Once I pay the 75 for meal it leaves me about 125 for raffles. That doesn't go far. Sure luck is fun but checkin 200 tickets instead of 20 makes it more fun for some. Lots of people drop 1 to 2 k at these banquets. Lots of people get write offs too. Guys who can spend 190k for one tag is going to change his thinking and devalue the system as it is. Adding more tags will screw things up. Bidding wars is what gets the big bucks due to very limited tags. More tags is going to mean more chances at cheaper tags. It's all about $$$!. They want more opportunities to harvest Az trophy animals. PERIOD. Backdooring arizona hunters is nothing new to this bunch. Reading the fine print always shows their true colors. Telling you what you want to hear but not following thru. Call it what you like it's stealing opportunities from joe hunter. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ThomC Report post Posted May 15, 2018 I see the red man is here fighting for his masters again. I remember when Pete was hired by Don Peay. After the last tag grab failure and the mess in Alaska they suddenly said there was no financial connection between AZSFW and SFW. Really? You are just a plant by Pete and you know it. You talk about honor yet admitted to me that you posed as a journalist to befriend the HSUS top people and got all of their personal info. You certainly picked the right handle on here nefarious. I read an article from Alaska where Peay was bragging about getting "his" people to control G&F there. You can bet that has already started here. Show up at the June meeting and send RedPeter packing--again.you're still uttering your nonsense. Those people whom "regularly" seem lucky at banquets, are usually spending 5 to 10 times what an average Joe can spend. I try to pick one a yr. Once I pay the 75 for meal it leaves me about 125 for raffles. That doesn't go far. Sure luck is fun but checkin 200 tickets instead of 20 makes it more fun for some. Lots of people drop 1 to 2 k at these banquets. Lots of people get write offs too. Guys who can spend 190k for one tag is going to change his thinking and devalue the system as it is. Adding more tags will screw things up. Bidding wars is what gets the big bucks due to very limited tags. More tags is going to mean more chances at cheaper tags. It's all about $$$!. They want more opportunities to harvest Az trophy animals. PERIOD. Backdooring arizona hunters is nothing new to this bunch. Reading the fine print always shows their true colors. Telling you what you want to hear but not following thru. Call it what you like it's stealing opportunities from joe hunt more opportunities to harvest money More opportunities to harvest money selling trophy animals. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
300RUM Report post Posted May 15, 2018 I went and found a grade school lesson on probability, just for Red. Probability measures the likelihood of an event occurring. Expressed mathematically, probability equals the number of ways a specified event can occur, divided by the total number of all possible event occurrences. For example, if you have a bag containing three marbles -- one blue marble and two green marbles -- the probability of grabbing a blue marble sight unseen is 1/3. There is one possible outcome where the blue marble is selected, but three total possible trial outcomes -- blue, green, and green. Using the same math the probability of grabbing a green marble is 2/3. Now imagine a lottery for an elk tag in which 100 tickets are purchased. Joe buys 50 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 50% Bob buys 20 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 20% Jack buys 14 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 14% Ron buys 10 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 10% Tim buys 5 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 5% John buys 1 ticket, the probability that he will win the tag is 1% It’s grade school math. A raffle favors those with the means to purchase more tickets so all who enter do not have an equal chance. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nefarious Red Report post Posted May 15, 2018 I went and found a grade school lesson on probability, just for Red. Probability measures the likelihood of an event occurring. Expressed mathematically, probability equals the number of ways a specified event can occur, divided by the total number of all possible event occurrences. For example, if you have a bag containing three marbles -- one blue marble and two green marbles -- the probability of grabbing a blue marble sight unseen is 1/3. There is one possible outcome where the blue marble is selected, but three total possible trial outcomes -- blue, green, and green. Using the same math the probability of grabbing a green marble is 2/3. Now imagine a lottery for an elk tag in which 100 tickets are purchased. Joe buys 50 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 50% Bob buys 20 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 20% Jack buys 14 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 14% Ron buys 10 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 10% Tim buys 5 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 5% John buys 1 ticket, the probability that he will win the tag is 1% It’s grade school math. A raffle favors those with the means to purchase more tickets so all who enter do not have an equal chance. dude, you're like the energizer bunny of crybabies. You just keep going and going and going. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AZDirtyTaco Report post Posted May 15, 2018 If anyone is interested in hearing more from the Nimrod Society https://nimrodsociety.org/, please send me your email address. I will CC you on my next response to them and encourage you to reach out to Bob and Allen on your own as well. I've been keeping up with the conversation here lately, but have not been as engaged due to family, work, sports, life in general. They followed up with me over the weekend and I would like to loop in anyone interested. There are many other models out there that have accomplished EXACTLY what is being used as the driving topic of "public education" without prostituting wildlife (stole your analogy Flatlander) . I like what NIMROD has said and what their record of performance shows. I would love to see them enter the conversation and become involved. It's good conversation here on the forums but lets please focus our real energy on a strategy of moving forward with solutions not involving CAPAZ. There is zero sense in any attempt to work with them on alternatives, as they are clearly not interested, which in my opinion tipped there hand most. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AZkiller Report post Posted May 15, 2018 I went and found a grade school lesson on probability, just for Red. Probability measures the likelihood of an event occurring. Expressed mathematically, probability equals the number of ways a specified event can occur, divided by the total number of all possible event occurrences. For example, if you have a bag containing three marbles -- one blue marble and two green marbles -- the probability of grabbing a blue marble sight unseen is 1/3. There is one possible outcome where the blue marble is selected, but three total possible trial outcomes -- blue, green, and green. Using the same math the probability of grabbing a green marble is 2/3. Now imagine a lottery for an elk tag in which 100 tickets are purchased. Joe buys 50 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 50% Bob buys 20 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 20% Jack buys 14 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 14% Ron buys 10 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 10% Tim buys 5 tickets, the probability that he will win the tag is 5% John buys 1 ticket, the probability that he will win the tag is 1% Its grade school math. A raffle favors those with the means to purchase more tickets so all who enter do not have an equal chance. Take away? Hate Joe, love John and feel the Bern. I see more class warfare. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idgaf Report post Posted May 15, 2018 Fred I am on the HPC Committee. If you would like you or anyone else can call me and I will try and answer your questions. Dave 602-228 - 1719 Dave, Just curious who uses the money? Is it the critter groups? The PDF shows how the money is used, but who does the work? Fred Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AZDirtyTaco Report post Posted May 15, 2018 Is anyone interested in posting a thread that has a comprehensive list of contacts? The AZGFD list posted earlier by idgaf on page 3 is a good start. No opinions, no BS, just info. We need a one stop resource so people aren't forced to dig through what is now several threads and must be pushing 80 pages. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azelkhunter2 Report post Posted May 15, 2018 Fred.....I type with two fingers and there is a lot that goes into the what...Why and how and would take me an hour to type out. Please call me and I can explain it to you. You can translate it and post it if you like I have nothing to hide. If you or anyone else would like to see the process in person I would be happy to have you or anyone else join me at the next meeting where we discuss and fund multiple projects....Thanks Dave Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GJMauro12 Report post Posted June 3, 2018 Jay just dropped another podcast with Pete Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GreyGhost85 Report post Posted June 3, 2018 What did that sneaky asshole have to say this time? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
