Riesop Report post Posted December 30, 2020 I agree 1 million percent that non residents should go to a draw. I have also heard that January hunts may only be first two weeks of January instead of the whole month. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CatfishKev Report post Posted December 30, 2020 16 minutes ago, Riesop said: I agree 1 million percent that non residents should go to a draw. I have also heard that January hunts may only be first two weeks of January instead of the whole month. That would be stupid to make the jan hunt the dirst 2 weeks, at least down here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oz31p Report post Posted December 30, 2020 1 minute ago, CatfishKev said: That would be stupid to make the jan hunt the dirst 2 weeks, at least down here. I think stupid would be making any changes with out knowing how many deer are killed. also I figured out a long time ago. “Lame and fishy” has a plan, could give a dam what sportsman think, will implement their plan as they see fit. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flatlander Report post Posted December 30, 2020 15 minutes ago, Riesop said: I agree 1 million percent that non residents should go to a draw. I have also heard that January hunts may only be first two weeks of January instead of the whole month. The guidelines lay this out. If archery harvest exceeds 20% the first adjustment is to eliminate December, then reduce January to two weeks, then it goes to a draw. Here is a link to the guidelines in case anyone is into reading. https://azgfd-portal-wordpress-pantheon.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/archive/AZ-Hunt-Guidelines-2018-2023_7-26-2019.pdf 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oz31p Report post Posted December 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Flatlander said: The guidelines lay this out. If archery harvest exceeds 20% the first adjustment is to eliminate December, then reduce January to two weeks, then it goes to a draw. Here is a link to the guidelines in case anyone is into reading. https://azgfd-portal-wordpress-pantheon.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/archive/AZ-Hunt-Guidelines-2018-2023_7-26-2019.pdf How are harvest numbers collected? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flatlander Report post Posted December 30, 2020 15 minutes ago, oz31p said: How are harvest numbers collected? We’ve been through this. You know the answer but since you clearly (by posting the question 3x) can’t move on without making your point, we can go over it again. Volunteer responses to hunt surveys are the only data they currently collect. The suggestion has been made before that it be mandatory. The dept feels that compelling responses could create less accurate data. That idea could be challenged but from an input standpoint, I am less inclined to tell them HOW to do their job (collect their data) but more inclined to provide input on what I would like them to accomplish. You don’t have to agree. You can and should speak up at a meeting about this. This may be a bit off track for the current discussion and may warrant a different thread if we want to explore or discuss it further out of respect to the OP. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oz31p Report post Posted December 30, 2020 6 minutes ago, Flatlander said: We’ve been through this. You know the answer but since you clearly (by posting the question 3x) can’t move on without making your point, we can go over it again. Volunteer responses to hunt surveys are the only data they currently collect. The suggestion has been made before that it be mandatory. The dept feels that compelling responses could create less accurate data. That idea could be challenged but from aninput standpoint, I am less inclined to tell them HOW to do their job (collect their data) but more inclined to provide input on what I would like them to accomplish. You don’t have to agree. You can and should speak up at a meeting about this. This may be a bit off track for the current discussion and may warrant a different thread if we want to explore or discuss it further out of respect to the OP. If I had the answer I wouldn’t have asked at all. I agree with you. I just didn’t know 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flatlander Report post Posted December 30, 2020 5 minutes ago, oz31p said: If I had the answer I wouldn’t have asked at all. I agree with you. I just didn’t know My apologies. There are a number of folks on here who have beaten this to death per the years. I assumed you were one of them. And well, you know what happens when we assume. My bad. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bonecollector Report post Posted December 30, 2020 6 hours ago, jdown said: I've said this a few times, have to quit shooting spikes, reduce the number of tags by 1/3 or more and double the price of a deer tag if you want to make up for it. Are spikes breeding much if at all? If you shoot a spike your saving a big mature deer to breed more. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CouesFanatic Report post Posted December 30, 2020 It's not about who breeds more its about what age class is out there. A spike is a future 120 buck. If we shoot too many deer, nothing gets old. 1.5 year old spike or a 3.5 year old 70 inch buck. who has the better genetics? I don't know, but older bucks breeding more does doesn't equal better genetics. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bonecollector Report post Posted December 30, 2020 14 minutes ago, CouesFanatic said: It's not about who breeds more its about what age class is out there. A spike is a future 120 buck. If we shoot too many deer, nothing gets old. 1.5 year old spike or a 3.5 year old 70 inch buck. who has the better genetics? I don't know, but older bucks breeding more does doesn't equal better genetics. Talking genetics or the amount of deer? A spike is not guaranteed to be a future 120" could have shitty genetics and never get to a 100 even with age. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Riesop Report post Posted December 30, 2020 I think the start has to be mandatory reporting, however that may be done I have no idea. How many people do you think in our world, as dishonest as it is, would shoot a deer in January, not report it, and just continue hunting the rest of the year like nothing happened. It's sad but its reality. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CouesFanatic Report post Posted December 30, 2020 21 minutes ago, bonecollector said: Talking genetics or the amount of deer? A spike is not guaranteed to be a future 120" could have shitty genetics and never get to a 100 even with age. I agree with you. Its difficult to know the genetics of an animal. Thats why I think point restriction programs struggle. I think the point of the thread is that we are killing too many deer and would like to limit NR's if we have to cut tags somewhere. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grugle Report post Posted December 31, 2020 Non - residents are flooding Arizona for these OTC hunts , Great weather and hunting when all other options are pretty much over in other states . The tag fees are minimal for the opportunity it provides .. I do think it will change to a draw at some point , maybe a separate draw that takes place after the June deadline draw is over ..with tags issued through a draw you may be able to get a more accurate account of the true harvesting taking place and the pressure some of these units are getting . Who knows what will happen It just been very surprising seeing non-res hunting some of the places I have recently , and these hunters are coming from a long ways away not just Cali,Utah and Texas. Arizona is just a very popular place to move and hunt these days unfortunately those of us natives it will impact the hunting we’re used to at some point . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bowhunter4life Report post Posted December 31, 2020 5 hours ago, Flatlander said: I left a message for Amber Munig. If I get a response I will keep everyone posted. You might want to do a public record request- this way you will get all of 2019 & 2020 resident and non resident OTC deer tag number to compare. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites