alexjh1

Thanks guys for the help. Hopefully I will be posting pic's of my first Couse along side my boy in Dec. Hope to see yours as well. Alex

I posted earlier this year on my unit 29 hunt last year which was incredible with the landscape and all the animals we came across. Few and far inbetween bucks and a lot of does. I had a lot of fun with my boy after figuring out access to the public land and found a really cool 4x5 deer skull with pan ends on it. I did what I have never done by sitting up high, sat and glassed which worked out as I have never seen that many animals to include Javelina, deer and the forum agreed that that is how to get it started. As I plan my hunt the day after thanksgiving, I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on where as in a good location and how to conduct my hunt down to the times. I am new to deer hunting and this will be my 4rth attempt at it. I would love to put some meat in my frezer and get my boy excited about the experience, he will regardless. Any tips or suggestions will help and are welcome. Thanks, Alex

I fairly new to whitetail hunting and it appears there are a lot of does out there, I see them all the time. I think this is a fantastic opportunity to get my 15 year old going or any youth for that matter. The only problem is looking over the regs, there are not the same opportunies like other states for doe hunting for youth. I am sure the answer is the balance of our states deer population, maybe I am just lucky and see so many, just not so lucky with ones with antlers..ha ha. This years regs I did see one opportunity for antlerless deer in what looked like there was one in 12A however that was it. I guess more of a statement than a question.

I have been hunting for a few years, enjoying time with my boy out doors which he loves. Dont get me wrong, I love being outdoors and appreciate nature, harvesting an animal would only be a bonus Not being from a hunting family everything I read is on other states, mainly west coast whitetail. I have read one book on Couse here in AZ however I have questions on a couple of deer habits. OK, my basic deer questions: When Couse whitetail rut? Met up with an old timer on my last, my second, hunt and he said they wont get started until January. When do they use water? worth it to set up around water? I have seen a few deer come into water durring the afternoon however seen so many more just forage when glassing. Rattling and grunting? Does this work in Az?

I recently got excited about my Unit 29 draw and went back to my last year hunt of seeing a whole lot of deer at a distance and some close however none had antlers in my late Dec hunt. One of the forum member asked about my optics and they are not so good. I bit the bullet after my draw and went out to Cabelas to buy the best I could afford. I have to be honest, I am really excited to pick up my Nikon Monarch 4-16 x 42 rifle scope for my 270 and it has the bullet drop compensator which is I think is pretty cool. Any thoughts on this scope? Either way it beats my old 9 power pretty cheap scope. Oh, my hunt is in 29 late Nov through early Dec. Thanks, Alex

I agree, regardless of what is left at a water hole, or anywhere for that matter, first come first serve. If there is a blind or a stand you have the right to put your up as well. Come opening day you have to get there first. Rules of engagement state that if there is someone there first, ethically you should give them the spot. That is a tough pill to swallow given we are all proud and have the right to hunt public land. I feel, regardless of how long I have left my blind there, if someone beats me to it, the spot is theirs for the day, better believe I will be there before them in the am and will expect the same courtesy. Everyone leaves equipment to let it gain the scent of nature rather than ours, any time you see other equipment, no matter how old, let it be. YOu could have a real problem if I came creaping over a hill and I saw you trying to take my equipment down, I would assume you are stealing it. There are no eyes in the hills so you never know what someone is capable of or where they are.

I have hunted 36C, Elkhorn Ranch about 4 times now and have never had a problem. Going in and out I have seen the illegals running through the desert, come into clearings of like a million water bottles. Really, the illegals avoid any contact, I tent it so I should really be concerned however never had a problem. I have heard the stories of raiding your camp, stealing your car and worse, I have even dissabled my truck on my trips however never had any issues. There are a ton of border patrol, air recons and hellicoptors going over the area. I have stopped and talked to the border patrol guys who told me, they are scared of us, just avoid them and you will be fine. Normally, if you are impacted, they may raid your camp for food and water however nothing deadly. I have heard and read so many stories on the deadly drug smuglers, yes they are out ther I just have never come accross them and if I did, heck, I am a hunter and would just blend with my camo and head the other way. Something tells me you can tell the difference between a drug smuggler packing an AK vs a family trying to sneak over the border. Just my thoughts, I dont fear the souther units, been in 36 C 4 times and out in 29 3 times, never an issue. If you can find animals or get drawn there go for it, I have taken my boy with me and had full confidence. PS, I did have a side arm, never can be to careful. Use comon sense.. Enjoy your hunt, Alex

Thanks guys on the discussion, dont ask about my bino's, its ugly. I thought I would start with my rifle scope. As I started this hunting thing, I was pretty sure power was everything and now I know differently. Started with a cheap pair of 10x50's, wasted $150 on a huge pair of bino's that belong on a ship not in the field. I have found since my purchase it is very heavy and not worth hiking in and out of my hunting area. Excited about the scope, very clear and bright vs the other scopes I looked at. Alex

Amanda posted some good information for me on couse biology and listed the link below for this website. It covers the "Cactus" couse briefly. here is a link to the life stages page which describes breeding timing and other related biology info. http://www.coueswhitetail.com/coues_biology/life_stages.htm Alex

Well, a buddy has a kid who works at Cabelas and there was an employee discount thing going on. Really tough because the invite doesnt tell you how much you get off. It was sad, the scope was so much nicer than my original....impulse buy...after 2 hours of looking at the different scopes. For any of you who ever get the opportunity. I was told the discounts, employee, for Cabelas go up to 20%. Basically Cabelas products you will get up to 20% and all other items go down from there more like 10%. My employee discount coveredthe tax, I walked out the door about $430. I cant complain, I had the money and got a discount. Thanks for the feedback.

I had some questions relating to Couse feeding and waterning habits. Amanda posted a link for me which I had read through. There is a picture and a quick description of a "cactus" buck. Take a look if you are interested. here is a link to the life stages page which describes breeding timing and other related biology info. http://www.coueswhitetail.com/coues_biology/life_stages.htm

I have asked the same questions around water and how deer will utilize. Everyone I have talked to and all that I have read points to the fact that it varies. If there is a lack of water, deer will have to rely more on water holes..they key there is rely more on water and defining what that is. If there are pockets of water, dew or snow they will be less likely to rely on water holes. I have also talked to many and read that the couse get most of the moisture they need from the vegitation they eat so watering is not a daily occurance. Arizona is an odd place, we can be in a "drought" however one rain, morning dew or just a few inches of snow just before or while you go hunting change the game for you. My 2 cents,

Amanda and Nate, Thank you both for your responses. I do have the How to Hunt Coues Deer book and have read it many times over to find if I am missing anything. It falls short on several topics for the novice. Water it gives a very high level answers, topo map reading and it kind of skirts the rutting period (when do they). I will say this, not the smartest moment in life, I went archery deer a few years back 36c with a friend, I want to say it was in October. This book has a great section on warm weather hunting, man O man, ticks, black flies and Rattlers were only some of the beasties I came across. Not a fun trip, stay clear of warm weather hunting in AZ there is a day and night shift of bugs, spiders and rattlers. So, Nate, your answers really help especially with the self taught hunter part, it gives me hope and insight. I have learned every time I go out just a bit more, however if you dont know its broken you cant fix it which is why I posted on this site. I feel I am on the right track with all of your postings. Well, now I guess time in the field, locating them again, closing the distance and a bit of luck I will harvest my first couse. You really cant lose being out there...unless you are warm weather hunting...thanks again everyone.

I am a novice hunter and tried my hand at bow hunting, got lucky on a bull Elk 6 years ago, so went after whitetail deer 3 years ago, I will pause a second to give all of you a second to stop laughing...ha ha. I came across a couple of deer and one buck usually ranging from 60 - 250 yards, and mostly a flash of white made me think I should start out rifle hunting for these beautiful animals. No glassing, spot and stalk.. (Unit 36c) Last year I finally got drawn in unit 29 for them, took my 15 year old who is interested in the sport. Plan was to find a spot and just glass. First few days out, I really struggled with access to public land, it was almost as if strips of land were sold to block access to public land. I bought maps before my next trip out. Every land owner there posted signs no hunting every 20 yrds or so. Oh, by the way, white tail deer sit right inside those fences, all times of the day, and if they could smile, I think they were. Very funny funny though and my kid enjoyed the sightings. Finally found access sat high and must have seen 50-70 deer however 99.9% of them were does a couple of javelina. I glassed a couple of bucks (2)about a mile away, to far to move on. Tried to get accross a canyon and sit the next day, it was almost as if they all dissapeared. I think I was in a good spot, deer bumped into me daily which scared the heck out of me when 10 - 20 yards away the snort/wheeze blows up behind you. You all know the sound. Just asking, am I on the right track? Should I do anything differently? This was a Dec hunt and I put in for it again this year, I want another crack at it. I will admit, it was freaken cold, about 15 deg with snow, 5500 in elevation, so I was out about an hour after sun up and in place for the day. We headed back to camp about 20 minutes just shy of dark. All camo, scent block... the works. Tell me this unit is full of a massive tribe of lesbion deer and I will not feel bad with all the lack of buck sightings. Thanks, Alex

One of the members talked about a tree stand, man that is tough in the southern end of the state so I do have a ground blind. The difficult part is where to put it. Game trails are everywhere, there are water holes. So with all of the days I spent in unit 29 and all of the deer I saw, I only saw two of them come into water...ha ha does. Now that brings me to my next deer education question. Rutting, I have been out in December 2 x's now and bucks were not chasing does like in the hunting shows or how the books say they do. I talked to an old timer who told me whitetails get to rutting in January not December in southern AZ. Is that true? Second question, water, should I set up on water? I have seen many elk come in and water durring the evening hours however deer and javelina dont follow the same schedule. OK, my basic deer questions: When whitetail rut? When do they use water? worth it to set up around water? Rattling and grunting? Does this work in Az?

Oh bruther, 15, you are just my boys age. He turns 16 this Nov. The tough part is figuring it out. I love watching the hunting channel, however, they all hunt on ranches in front of huge fields of feed. We live in AZ and it is way different out here. These are desert couse deer and there is no handbook for hunting them. If you dont grow up with someone guiding you it it is tough to learn. The funniest part is talking to hunters, they all love the honey holes and will give you the general info...stay high, wear out the seat of your pants before your boots. Disclaimer, this website is the first place I stumbled upon that people actually want to help. The other general info, Ok, got that part, and not looking for anyones honey hole as I am willing to put in my own time and hiking. Everything I read is on back east, heck, those guys use shotguns..I laugh every time, it is so funny, I swear everytime I pick up a book or an magazine I am waiting for one to mention clubbing a deer because it was so close. To make it worse, those guys have to bag a doe or two before they are allowed to harvest a buck. Now that is good stuff. If I am not succesful in getting drawn, I am willing to tag along if anyone will have me, just to see how it is done. You can blind fold me, no funny business though, and I will be willing to tent it in camp I got the gear. Alex

Thanks for the advise everyone, keep it coming. I feel like I am on the right track. Optics, not a good situation, this is an expensive hobby so I am saving. That makes sense, with all of the deer I glassed up there may have been smaller racks which I just thought were does given my optics. In another area I scouted, I found a really cool skull with 5 x4 that was a dream deer for me, brought it home to add to my collection of finds. I have never harvested a deer and would like to put some meet in my freezer. I am not a trophy hunter....yet, my thought is you need to crawl before you walk. My family was big on fishing here in AZ growing up. I caught the hunting bug in my late twenties. Went out with a guy who showed me the ropes, got sooo lucky and baged a cow elk archery and was hooked ever since. Truth be told, sharing the experience with my boys and letting them see wild animals and beautiful wilderness is my trophy. Harvesting an animal will just be a bonus. I have much to learn and you all are contibuting. I am 1 for 3 elk hunting, my initial cow. I am 1 for two turkey hunting...that was fun. Now Javelina are killing me, I am 0 for 5 and now and I put in because I have to prove that they really exist durring hunting season. Every year I learn more, see more and new areas. CouesKilla, I will definitely hit you up if I am lucky enough to get drawn again. Waiting to see where I end up if at all, put in for 36C and 29 again.

Been in unit ten for Elk a few times, I have seen a small group deer once in that time and I have put a lot ot miles on my boots there scouting. Are there deer there....yes, probably not the hotspot you are hoping for. I think I have seen more antalope, Elk and even donkeys in that area than I have seen deer. Sorry for the bad report but that has been my experience in that unit. I spent my time in the southern end of unit 10. Good luck.

Thanks guys, I really apreciate your support. Yes, very excited to get out and see deer and share with my son any time. Not enough parants doing it these days. Talked to the wildlife officer in Tuscon which gave me the best advice for the success I had which was get high and spend more time glassing than hiking. I will say that helped a ton in locating the animals. I did purchase the book after my archery attempt last year which again helped a lot. The book lacked a little in the details all hunters are looking for. Great basic concepts on the hunts and the deer. I wont give up, I think I am more excited and determined than ever after this trip. I was looking for that next step in closing the distance and understanding the deer.

OK, last year I tried my first ever white tail deer hunt with an over the counter archery tag. While hunting Javelina in 36c I had came across a lot of coues deer and said, man this should be a slam dunk. I had seen the same buck 10 pointer multiple years on the same hill. Come archery season, late December, I could not get with in 250 yards of him and the rest of the deer just vanished...thats coues deer right! Thought I would outsmart them and go rifle hunting this year in 29, spent my first week just trying to find a way around the private land..wow what a chore, Maps help! I just got back from a week long attempt at those little guys. First day glassed up 30+ females no bucks, it had snowed 4-6 inches everywhere. My son and I were in sight of a water tank from the hill we were glassing. Second day less deer, 2 javelina and 2 bucks 3/4 mile out. They barely came out of some really thick trees. I have read everything I can, glassed more than hiked and having a tough time figuring these guys out. The warmer it got the less deer I saw, they were moving up til about 11:00-12:00am which goes against everything I have read. So, my questions are..I am new at this and would like to teach my 15 year old son what I never learned growing up..how do these guys work? Do they water regularly, morning or night? Movements and when? How does weather and the moon affect them? Rut, oh dont get me started...Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb...When do they actually rut, I thought the cold kicked them into gear and the snow would do the trick...no luck, they were not interested in the brothel of females infront of them. Any help would be appreciated.