THE RIFLEMAN

In 22 and 23 at a 7% sucess rate for archery = How many deer???? Lets hear some actual harvest numbers!!!! Using this logic just removing 2 or 3 mountain lions should make up for the excesive amount of white tails being harvesred by archery baiters! This x game manager is full of it! Tonto Rim also make the unlogical referance to revenue lost from loss of sales of rifle tags and how the G&F is losing $$ from its fund.... This is meaningles because all the $$ in the G&F is swept into a the general fund ... It's been this way since Napolitano mandated it ... Another conspiracy! If this is truly about lost revenue for the G&F then I suggest that someone in the G&F stand up to the state and retain the funds the the AZGFD generates! To be spent on conservation like we voted on! Not swept into the general fund!!!!! The way the AZGFD is looked at by the State Government is a revenue source to bail its a$$ out in other areas! This is the true explanation of the loss of 100's of December rifle tags and the introduction of extra rifle hunts in October and November! This was done soley for revenue and not because of archery succes rates..... baiting with food or salt or whatever! Again I say enforce the existing laws before making new uninforcible laws! Answere this dierectly Tonto Rim! I dare YA!

Its listed on craigs list for $800 I don't know how to do pics here but to see it look on craigs list - $600 to CWT folks new tires runs great! Low hours!

And the 1000's of illegals stampeding north don't do any harm to Jaguar habittat! To bad there arn't enough Jags to eat all the Illegals!

Try putting some corn or oats out in the forest for wild deer to eat and chances are the ants and birds will get it well before the deer even notice it! On the other hand rural deer that grow up eating bird seed and grain in back yards are totally differant! This backyard style of baiting is why the late hunts have been canceled in some units! Red lights go of when the archery sucess rate raise's above 12% .... 99.9% of the deer shot over bait in Arizona are shot in someones back yard! The property owners are also inviting their buddies to fill out their tags on the last day , a deer for each of the family members the list goes on ........When its easy everyone gets in on the fun!!!! Some counties (Pinal &Maricopa) already have county laws prohibiting feeding deer and elk on private property and not 1 citation has been issued! The folks feeding can just say they where feedin the birds.....If the G&F LEO's really want to prosecute some one for this they would really have to work at it! Not likely to happen ...It's easier to just make more uninforcible laws and act like they are real busy! I had a feeder way out in the woods and it took 3 years of feeding the pigs and birds before any deer statred hitting it regular enough to count on for slying a buck! My point is baiting out in the forest does not guarantee instant sucess.....Why the new laws enforce the existing laws! My take on this baiting ban is that it is generated by died in the wool rifle only hunters who have allways resented archery hunting in some way or another! Some local archery shop ownwers are also for the ban because they feel baiting will cause the loss of over the counter deer tags and a loss of buisness! The king baby rifle only complainers and greedy archery bizz folks need to shut the front door and quit rockin the boat! As for what OpticTurd proposes about baits becoming less effective that is probably true with the salt products that hunter joe buys at Bass Pro - I recently hiked the areas around some popular water holes and found multiple salt/mineral licks at each hole several with cameras on them... The deer don't have far to go and lots of selection when it comes to salt licken!!!! Its a biological fact the the deer are healthier when they have these minerals so I am all for it .... It would work better for slayin deer if there was only one lick per water hole! As for feed or licks concentrating deer and spreading CWD faster this is a moot point ; In AZ the deer are already concentrated around water sources!!!! The main reason we dont have CWD is because it dosn't weathter the hot dry conditions here in the southwest! If a CWD pathogen is going to survive a long hot/dry summer here in AZ it will be at a water source! Again I say enforce the existing laws before making new one's ..........

Understood, but my personal philosophy is to not participate in activities I do not believe in or have interest in and try to refrain from telling other people how to pursue game. If you have a tag, you are legal to kill an animal. What are you interested in?!!!! How do you hunt with a short spear and a trained ferret???? LOL

There well known players pushing for this bait ban , hunters and people in the hunting buisness.... I know of one who activly goes to the meetings and has pursued this for several years... Arhery buisness owner EV ..... Does he have the bullocks to come on here and speak up ?????? I personally think everyone should salt and grain deer and elk!

If you don't like the dust just put large rocks in the raod to slow the a$$holes down!

Great point I can see the FS being named/included in a suit , especially if this happened on one of the roads marked as primative/not maintained ... The liability assumed by the FS is negligent on this one!

More areas closed means that eventually there will be less areas that need patroling.....The FS also wants the revenue from hunters staying in one of their developed "pay" camp grounds! This eventually adds up to more money to buy doughnuts and more time to eat them! Wilderness camping will be a thing of the past in 20 years or less! BIG BRUTHA IS WATCHING! It would also be interesting to know if they are ticketing regular weekend campers or just the evil hunters!

Texting me while I'm sitting in a blind/treestand.

I think the key word here is "Commisoner"... A politically appointed position... Politician = Crook in this day and age ... He just did the smart thing and turned himself in to eliminate a future "skeleton in the closet"... Smart crooks these days....!

Sounds like ur hunting buddy was tampered with early in life! Possibly a little lite in the loafers as a result!

So I took my high traffic area cameras down for the week end wariors .. No good bucks just three small ones don't know how to post pcis yet. No camera's missing and I had 9 cameras on 3 water holes 3 per watere hole.. I put them up Sunday eve and took them down this afternoon.... There were human visitors at one waterhole and they noticed one of the cameras and left it alone! Thanks to who ever that was!!!!

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Video will be all the proof I need, trail cams do that sort of thing. As for the question of finding an officer who will actually charge the scum, well I have that one covered too. Usually cops take reports ,write tickets and make arrests based on evidence ... A complaint would be filled out by you the victim and this is the process that would bring charges to a person that you write the complaint against. So you are the one bringing "charges":.... Yes the state can and does "pick up" cases and file their own charges but it would be highly unlikely the state would get involved prosecuting something like this unless it involved other more serious charges! The burden of proof woulod be completly on you to prove the loss , the value, ownership and all the other details like the exact location where the crime occured , the exact time, who put the camera there , pictures of the site before and after the alledged theft ect the trail of evidence has to be bullet proof sorry to say video and pics of some guy picking up a camera is not enough yes they are great to have but not enough to win a case like this .... Don't get me wrong I would love to see you prosecute the person who removed your camera from where you left it out on public land unguarded for extended periods of time! Yea what i am saying here probably P'S you off ..... Bottom line is it'a public land it's no different than if you mounted your trail cam on a tree in a park in downtown pheonix and came back two weeks later to find it "missing".......Now go find a cop who will thow the "theif" in jail... You may be the one who gets arrested for placing suspicious devices in a public place! Go run out the door of sportsmans with a trail camera in hand! Hummm...., the cops would have your a$$!!! They would loose the same amount of $ as everbody else loosing a camera. But suddenly its a CRIME!! It's BS! Stealing is stealing! Period! Public or private NO difference...Hang em at high noon! If its such a serious offense to you than just waste the guy when/if you find out who he is! Why mess around with posting his mug , harsh language and all the minor crap just kill the thief and be satisfied and shut up so you don't get caught! Or better yet take a hero picture of him with a huge head wound , eye ball dangling , blood dripping and post it on here anonymously of course!

Junior g girls doing extra credit projects for their F&G sponsor!

Video will be all the proof I need, trail cams do that sort of thing. As for the question of finding an officer who will actually charge the scum, well I have that one covered too. Usually cops take reports ,write tickets and make arrests based on evidence ... A complaint would be filled out by you the victim and this is the process that would bring charges to a person that you write the complaint against. So you are the one bringing "charges":.... Yes the state can and does "pick up" cases and file their own charges but it would be highly unlikely the state would get involved prosecuting something like this unless it involved other more serious charges! The burden of proof woulod be completly on you to prove the loss , the value, ownership and all the other details like the exact location where the crime occured , the exact time, who put the camera there , pictures of the site before and after the alledged theft ect the trail of evidence has to be bullet proof sorry to say video and pics of some guy picking up a camera is not enough yes they are great to have but not enough to win a case like this .... Don't get me wrong I would love to see you prosecute the person who removed your camera from where you left it out on public land unguarded for extended periods of time! Yea what i am saying here probably P'S you off ..... Bottom line is it'a public land it's no different than if you mounted your trail cam on a tree in a park in downtown pheonix and came back two weeks later to find it "missing".......Now go find a cop who will thow the "theif" in jail... You may be the one who gets arrested for placing suspicious devices in a public place!

Hang em High frontier man see what that gets ya! Yea its kinda strange LE,FS,BLM and AZGFD hide behind the law when it comes to removing our gear from the field and not one of the CS gmen has the aingst to discuss it on here! That LEO was on the other topic about hunting with the aid of vehicles and was infomative but it is a relatively safe topic for them..... Take note none of the LEO,or other Gmen will make comment per unwritten verbal directives avoiding this red herring! F'n cowards !!!!!!

You'd suprised who you talk to on the internet and what they do in their hobbies. Its also rediculously easy to set up a simple command prompt in an .exc file that can cause you problems for hours (if you know what you are doing, otherwise it make take much much longer), stepping it up to mess with other files (like say, of SyS32, or restore points to mess with them later) is just as easy. Espesially because you are just wanting to cause problems, and not monitor the actual computer. YOU COULD DO A BRISK BUISNESS SELLING PROGRAMMED CARDS TO REDNECKS LIKE ME - IF THEY REALLY WORK!

Taking a camera off public land is not a serious offense its a midemeranor at the worst! Unless its government owned or legally permitted equipment! The Forest Service and BLM are the only agencies willing to get involved with this activity and their involment is the removal of cameras , tree stands and pop up blinds when they find them... Its not illegal for the FS, BLM or AZF&G to remove any of this equipment from the field! This removal activity is at their discretion! So the option to leave it alone is there! Yes there are a few non Goverment scumbags taking our hunting equipment but mostly it is G men at fault! Even when a G&F employee got caught red handed on film taking cams off trees and with many marked cameras in his possesion he was only dismissed from his position and transfered or rehired at a later date! This really happened in unit 9 two years ago! Booby trapping cameras to do harm to anyone is illegal.... If anyone does this better be careful because harming a FS , a LEO or a BLM employee would be a federal offense! The law dosn't seem to protect anyone but the scumbags..... Oh yea I checked/reshearched and it is also a federal offense to introduce a virus via a SD card into some one elses computer even if they take the card from your equipment without your permission....Writing or transferring virus's knowingly is a federal offense! Are there really any technogeek hunter types inteligent enough to do this , not on this billy bob redneck site! I know it seems unfair but its the law. Friggin laws $uck wind! I dare any FS , BLM or Game and Fish management persons to come on here and discuss this topic in an official manner! They are way to busy counting trail cams to address this topic! Every time this topic comes up on this site or other hunting sites its just the hunters whining and getting all puffed up about the so called "thefts" it would be a big change to actually hear from some branch of the authorities on this!

Cordless grinders are a standard issue Forest Service tool! Good luck getting anything back if its the FS taking stuff!

Atribute this kind of luck to clean living! Dont even consider any other possibilties! The Az big game draw system is beyond reproach and uncoruptable! Come on man you know its jus clean living! Ignore the man behind the curtain HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA !!!! Yea right they probably got trail cam pictures of the Governor being indecent/indescrete out in the woods! Smells like blackmail to me!

I find it difficult to believe that the AZ Big Game Draw is the only uncorrupted area of the state government! Its too easy to get some dirt on some one and too easy to change things around with a few keystrokes.... Any of you that believe its an above boards draw probably voted for "HOPE" & "CHANGE" in the last presidential election!

Atribute this kind of luck to clean living! Dont even consider any other possibilties! The Az big game draw system is beyond reproach and uncoruptable! Come on man you know its jus clean living! Ignore the man behind the curtain HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA !!!!

ATF ...........................................................................