StickFlicker

Good luck! They are a beautiful animal.

Sir Royal, Your antelope is no slouch either! What did that score?

I understand it costs at least $10,000 to hunt there.

I hunted it once. You had to check in at the front gate every morning and every evening (the latter within 30 minutes of sundown as I recall), and have your truck searched (weather you had left the base or not). They tell you where to camp, which in our case was within a few yards of the train track. The train went by every hour or two at 90 mph blowing our tent everywhere and waking us up constantly through the night. The second night, they woke us up in the middle of the night and told us we had to move our camp several miles away to a different location they they chose. They gave us a map of the base that looked like it was drawn in crayon by one of the commaning officer's kids, I assume because they don't want an accurate detailed map of an army base floating around. Bombs were going off, seamingly within yards of me, while I was in the field. It was difficult to know where you were allowed to be and where you couldn't be. People would add and remove signs so it was hard to understand the boundaries (this could have been other hunters, but I don't know). I have heard of others having the elk scared out from under them by helicopters and other such things. As has been said, it is a military base and hunting is a very low priority there. All in all, although I killed an elk, it was not all that enjoyable as elk hunts go.

Depends on the unit as to whether I would shoot or not. However, of those two I would shoot the wide one.

jmall, As Nate mentioned, I am a measurer for both state record programs as well as Pope & Young and Boone & Crockett. Send me a PM and we can set something up. I am in Tramonto at I-17 and Carefree Highway, just a mile or so from Ben Avery Shooting Range. Marvin

24 bonus points and counting....

The most recent, 5th Edition (2010), shows 23 entries for desert sheep and 6 for rocky mountain. Corky entered his since the book was printed, so there are at least 24 deserts now. Barry Sopher also entered a new State Record Rocky since the printing, so there are at least 7 Rockies now as well.

bonecollector is completely correct. Have a good hunt!

I agree completely with Eli. Drought years are often when I find the biggest bucks. I have always felt it was because it forces the antelope to eat different things (that might cause their horns to grow larger) than the lush food they might prefer to eat in a wet year. However, Eli's dad seemed to have a different theorey, as I recall. I recall it being his belief that the plants grow faster in wet years, spreading the nutrients out in the plant. Eating a given amount of a plant delivered less nutrients than eating a similar amount of that same plant if it had grown slower in a drought year. I'm not sure which is correct, or if both might be factors?

Congratulations, that's a fantastic looking buck.

I would like to see the big game bag limits changed to something other than a calendar year (for exampble 7/01-6/30. It sucks taking a deer in January and then not being able to hunt again all through the fall (since most years won't yield a drawn tag for any other species). If the bag limits went from mid-year to mid-year, a person could take one deer in the winter hunts (Dec-Jan) and then could still hunt deer again after the long hot summer ends and the fall hunting seasons come around.

This was a two hour and 22 minute contest?

AZ Griz is correct. He is THE MAN on getting drawn in New Mexico!

Beautiful buck and mount. Congratulations. By the way, I see you live in Cave Creek. If you need it officially measured for any of the record books, let me know. I'm an official measurer for Pope & Young as well as Boone & Crockett and both state record programs. I live fairly close to you in Tramanto. Marvin

You can purchase a copy of the 28th Recording Period book by contacting Pope & Young. Historically, they have cost about $15 or so. (507) 867-4144 Email: admin@pope-young.org

I have two things I use. One is similar to the homemade ones above, except that I too use old carpet for the sole. These I can quickly slip over my shoes (wear tennis shoes most of the time, unless wet ground requires Gortex boots). These has shoe laces so I can quickly attach them. They don't take up much room. I also sometimes use mocassins that have had the sole strengthened by gluing on a layer of heavy felt. I get the felt bottoms that they make to put under your foot in waders. They come already cut to the size of your shoe. I have walked for hours and miles with both of these without a problem (but usually in the pines moreso than the desert).

Gary, I don't think Dave would mind this turning into a conversation about the process of panel scoring. He's the one that suggested I come to this thread after you weighed in with your thoughts. The rule requres that the top 5 of all time, in any category, must be panel scored for inclusion to the records. Normally, up to the five largest animals taken during a two year biannual period are invited to be panel scored. You must send your animal to be considered for biannual awards (plaques). If you are invited and choose not to send your trophy, your animal is not eligible to win a biannual award but will still be listed in the book, unless it is in the top five of all time for that category. The Bowhunting In Arizona Record Book Committee only requires a panel score if the animal falls in the top 3 of all time, with the same result if it is not submitted. It will not be listed in the record book. A Pope & Young panel score may substitute for a BIA panel. I actually served as a panel score measurer for the trophies submitted to the Dallas convention, and I was fortunate enough to measure some very nice animals. I am happy to answer any other questions that you may have on the process for any of these records programs. Marvin

Gary, If your buck's score was #5 of all time when it was entered, Pope & Young would not even have listed it in the records at all without your submitting it to be panel scored. So your statement that "his first official score would stand forever" would not be true. It would have not had any official score, because it would have been rejected for entry without a panel score. That is the organization's way of maintaining the top layer of the records as absolutely accurate as possible. Not all local measurers have the same experience, and sometimes they can make a mistake or just simply interpret the measuring rule differently than the Panel. Antlers do some very strange things sometimes, and the proper way to measure a particular rack may be subject to various interpretations, especially on non-typical antlers. A Panel of some of the most experienced Measurers re-measure those animals that are at the very top of each category to keep things fair to the top applicants that are in competition for Biannual Awards, as well as their trophy's final position in the listings. The Club does recognize that trophies are subject to shrinkage as time goes by, Therefore, credit for varying amounts of expected shrinkage are allowed during the panel scoring process based upon historical shrinkage records for each species, without any reduction in final score. If a score is changed, it is because the Panel has determined that some portion of the rack should be measured differently than the original scorer did, not just because it shrank a slight amount. It is also not unusual for the Panel to increase the score from the original score as well, if the Panel scores it higher than the original Measurer. There is an exeption for pending World Records, however, where no shrink factor is considered. This is presumably to keep the playing field completely level for the top entry of each category. There is no perfect system, but P&Y is constantly evolving to try to make the process as fair and accurate as possible for all trophies entered.

That is not what a Super Slam is. A bowhunting Super Slam is all 29 big game animals in NORTH AMERICA, as recognized by the Pope & Young Club. I believe you are thinking of a World Slam, which I understand is 12 sheep from around the world.

Congratulations, Mike! Great buck!

Congratulations Mark! I'm glad you had a great hunt. Marvin

Beautiful buck, congratulations! What state?

As was mentioned earlier, the Bowhunting In Arizona record book is a good source for such information. It has a table in the back that lists every hunter that has ever entered an animal to the records program, and a list of every animal that person has entered (whether or not it made the minimum for entry). Jim Machac has taken the Big 10 in AZ with a bow. Barry Sopher has taken EVERY big game animal in the State with a bow, including BOTH turkeys and BOTH sheep and every small predator (fox, bobcat and coyote). He is the first to do this and just completed it this year. Randy Liljenquist has taken the Super Slam (all North America big game species with a bow), but I don't believe he has taken a sheep in AZ with a bow.

I would guess 2:01 PM on 7/21, but that would not quite meet the 72 hour rule.....so I'll have to go with 7/25 9:31 AM.