Elmacho

Thanks to everyone for sending your advice. I am looking forward to it. You are always welcome to PM me if with any other info if you good luck in the draws and season! Mark

The rare, elusive 11 point...

Just throwing this out there...... If you hit a buck and do not recover him, did you burn your tag......or go hunt for a second buck? .....The ethical/moral dilemna................ If I don't have proof the buck is going to live...like seeing the arrow skim his back or brisket...no blood, my tag is done! Yes....its painful as heck.... My point is....that if hunters keep hunting on a second, third etc deer, the harvest objective may be continually exceeded if the number of dead deer reported is less than actual. (I frequently read about all the "lost bucks"...what about the second buck harvested?) We all owe it to the animals to police ourselves if we are going to call hunters the "stewards of wildlife" Hopefully the buck makes it....

Happy New Year! With the draws coming up, I pose this question! 19 Points as a resident ready for Early Rifle in a premier central AZ unit. What do you all think of the Early Rifle season being moved back a week? I realize 19 might not get it, but what if? El-

Thanks For the Help! Good luck to you guys in the draws!

Once I put in for a tag, when do the results come out? (Sorry, couldn't resist)

......Only Hunter!.......He's a beast!. Nice job guys on some beautiful bucks! Well done! Mark

Guys,....and Gals... I have a rifle that was shooting .7 groups for 5 years straight, with factory ammo....about 350 rds total. Barnes Vor-tx 140 grain was the key. I cant find another ammo that works. All of a sudden, it all went to heck. 3 inch groups. I went thru the gun, sent the scope back to leupold....all clear, put it on a mcmillan stock, reassembled it all and it is no good. WHO WOULD YOU ALL RECOMMEND TO TAKE THE RIFLE TO TO GO THRU IT, SHOOT IT AND AND GET IT BACK TO "NORMAL"? I have spent a ton of time and 1.5 years later cannot figure it out on my own. It is a Rem 700 CDL, 270WSM. Scope is a VX-3 4-14. Timney trigger at 3.0lbs.

Thanks to all of you! AFter getting a new mcmillan stock to fit me, bedding it, sending scope to leupold, nothing worked. Changed the Talley Rings for new ones, guess what? 2 fouling shots as normal Next shot dead nuts and the next 5 same place.. 6 shot group covered by a quarter......priceless...... it was so darnn frusterating trying to get this figured out.....1.5 years of PITA and she is back to the good ole days.... BTW....Nosler Trophy grade 140 accubond.....right combo! Thanks for all your imput, I definitely learned a bot from you all! Mark

ok. so I went thru it again. Changed ammo, it is definitely part of the problem. This verified something is wrong too. Groups are showing horizontal variance. 100 yd groups are 1 inch tall x 2.75 inches wide. Before I sent the scope back to leupold, I was having issues with 1" tall x 7" wide groups. So, I have concluded that some of the ammunition is at fault when they go all over the place, but have deduced that when the ammo is good, I still have a left-right issue. Gun is free floated and pillar bedded. What else causes this issue. Also, spoke with Talley about the rings....they told me they can wear out? REALLY???? never heard of that before....does that happen? again, appx 400 rds in the gun... Thanks, Mark

BustedKnuckle...thanks, I just ordered some Nosler loads....I have a hunch it may be the loads changed....especially since the barnes cartridges treated mevery well for so long. I found that the Blue-boxed federals were super accurate too, but upon shooting a coues with them last year, not impressed....pencil hole damage thru and thru for two shots....luckily it knicked an artery or it would have been a rodeo...we'll see how the Nosler cartridges work.. I also went ahead and did a doulde regimine of JB Bore Paste today.....with a brass brush....more dirty than anticipated....lets hope this was it ...period! (I looked with a magnifier and flash light down the bore from the crown and could see some bright red copper smiling at me........) Will go check the bottom metal too. Thanks again!

I see no visible damage to the crown with a 10x magnifing glass, but I am no expert. Definitely going to have it looked at. My cleaning routine is this: 2 patches of shooters choice copper remover, wait 5 minutes, scrub 10 laps with nylon brush, flush with gun scrubber, dry patch, repeat 3 times, or until clean patches, 2 oiled patches, 1 dry patch a few minutes later. I did a JB bore paste treatment 40 rounds ago....no effect Any names of really good smiths in upper phoenix, one that will also test loads through it? Very frusterating spedning more time trying to tinker with the gun than actually hunting or practicing.... Thanks guys!

After waiting 16 yrs as a NR to draw this tag, I knew I wanted to do it all up. I had the time to hunt the whole thing. Normally I am a DIY hunter, but given I may not draw another tag until I retire, I was looking for a guide that would take me out for two weeks and hunt our butts off for a chance at a true monster. After months of research, I decided to hire Hunter Haynes from Payson, AZ. He is a young man that spends the vast majority of his time in the Central AZ unit I was planning to draw. Whether he is hunting critters, sheds or fish, he is always out there wandering around God's creation. The hunt was epic and actually exceeded my expectations. We were passing mature bulls almost daily. I had opportunities at 5 bulls over 375 thru the course of the 14 day hunt. Several factors kept me from sealing the deal on any of them. Lightning storms, cows intervening, a black bear charging the harem trying to take out a calf, other guides moving in on top of us, even one guy who yelled from the hill above us to scare the bull we were stalking away....a nice 8x9 that was killed by that "hunter" on the rifle opener....but thats another story........ ...so over the course of 14 days, I had been in close quarters of a 375+ bull on 7 occasions without sucess.........on the last day, it was time to kill for meat. With one hour left in the hunt, I heard this bull bugle and start raking the brush.....everytime he raked, I ran. In short order, I was at 40 yds. The next time he raked, I drew back and when he took a break from raking and cleared his rack from covering his vitals, I loosed the arrow. The flight was true and the bull died 20 yds from me. Looking for a meat bull to take home, I didnt expect to kill a bull grossing 355 the last hour of the hunt. I want to thank Hunter Haynes for standing with me for 14+ long days, most that started at 3am and ended at 10pm+. He was very professional, courteous and maintained a positive attitude the duration of the hunt. His knowledge of every nook and cranny of the unit, especially in the dark, was unreal. If you are looking for a fair-chase, hard-core, no BS hunt, this is the guy. Did I mention he is also a Coues killer and bear assassin....he knows his stuff.... The hunt exceeded my expectations in every manner and created memories that will last my lifetime. .....DANG!....I hope I dont have to wait another 16 years........ Mark

AZ23 you have a PM

Thanks for all the kind words. Still ridin on cloud 9. No need to get into the incident with the A-hole guy who spooked off the monster, karma will get him. I decided not to pursue that fight at the time, or let it get into my head too much, as I was left with two more evenings and one morning to get it done. Needed to keep a clear head and positive attitude! Anyone looking to get into some serious game, give Hunter Haynes a call. Best of luck and safe hunting to all!

Great buck and great photo. Father-son moment of a lifetime.......many more to come I'm sure.....congratulations. Mark

check out differetn parts of the country- deer often "rut" a different times. AZ- dec-Jan, 6 mo later fawns are out- June- right at monsoon time. In so cal, rut is in Aug-Sept, i think, fawns drop in february or march- our rain season. colorado- Rut is late nov. fawns drop in May- thaw and green up time. Gestation, I think, is 6 months. They seem to know when to do their thing.

Love this site. This year I bought a bow and have been practicing, practicing, practicing. I usually hunt rifle down in 32 or 33, but this year have to wait until Jan to hunt because of baby on the way. Will have to stay closer to home. Any help would be appreciated as I am new to archery. No hotspots requested. I prefer spot and stalk, as that's how I rifle hunt. What tips can you guys share re type of habitat best suited in these units for archery. are the deer numbers decent enough to make this attempt? What are your experiences re deer densities- more to the north, mid or south part of these units. Any help is appreciated. Josh-you out there- I know you know these units......any help? Thanks guys, I am dying to stick one. Mark

I second AZ Guide's post. I've only been hunting these ghosts 3 years. I learned to be very patient in sitting down and just watching thru the glass. First year I was moving from spot to spot glassing around. Saw 5-10 deer a day. Second year sat a little more and saw 10-15/ day. third year sat for hours on end, never went back to camp until after dark and ended up seeing deer all times of the day. It's tiring but saw 20-25 deer per day. I figure the more deer you locate the more to choose from. All November hunts so far. Good luck, whack a toad.

Tall order. I am in same boat. Book bucks are tough. getting someone to share their honey hole is even tougher. good luck. El Macho

right on Rembrant- I'm an outta stater, but would jump all the hoops for a chance to get a tag. Most people I know think I'm nuts for buying a license for BPs and taking the course, but hey.......I love the hunt. I just hope they don't make a move that will jeopardize the quality ofhunting available in Arizona- it's tough to match. Good luck this year. Mark

Oh my........

Page 2 bottom photo......and no, I ain't no al quaeda. Good luck out there everyone. Can't wait for nov 12 to get here. Mark

I'M fAIRLY NEW TO THIS, SO i'LL CALL IT LUCK. IN 2002, A SAT UNDER A CHOLLA AND WAITED FOR LIGHT. ABOUT 8AM- THREE 90 INCH CLASS BUCKS WALK UP THE TRAIL 35-40 YARDS IN FRONT OF ME. THAT FAT MIDDLE ONE PAID FOR IT. 160 GRAIN BULLET TO THE HEART AND HE STILL RAN ABOUT 125 YDS. 2003 STILL/SLOW HUNTING WALKED TO 5 DIFFERENT DOES BETWEEN 15 AND 40 YARDS. DOES DON'T COUNT THOUGH. BUCKS SEEM MORE WARY. WILL TRY WITH A BOW THIS YEAR GOOD LUCK

Interesting topic...... I have been toiling with whether it is cheating or not. But since a friend handed me one just before I took a shot on a muley, and clarified I guessed 425 yds and it was 483, I figure now it is more ethical to assist with a clean kill, HOWEVER, you still need to practice a bunch before making a long shot. (yeah..he dropped on the first shot) With Coues being so small, a 300+ yard shot needs to be dead-on, not much room for error. Will be buying one this season! Mark