.270

me and my boy got us some late bull tags. we need a couple camp flunkies, i mean apprentices. ya know, get wood, keep the fire goin', cook for 6 or 8 guys, clean up, pack out elk, skin em, clean muddy boots, saddle the mules ever mornin', shoe em when they need it, etc. all the stuff my wife won't do anymore and she just stays home. then she complains i never take her anywhere. ever time i leave for a month or 2 when i come back she's got new toenails, new hairdo, massage bills, new furniture........ i can't even get a recliner broke in good. why in the heck woulda woman wanna do all that instead bein' the camp toady? can't figger em out. Lark.

i like to see kids learn about high explosives at a young age. wait, you didn't use a hook and line or some other crummy way did ya? Lark.

matty, nobody on here wants some smart@$$ with real facts and good info to get in the way of a good arguement. Lark.

you're over the line there, makin' fun o' skunks that a-way. that's some funny $h!t right there, i don't care who ya are. i hope he gets to see it. maybe he'll have griz write a letter comdemning your action. Lark.

i've never bought into the logic of not voting because no candidate was perfect. i'm going to vote for the best candidate and try real hard to support them. if the lesser of two evils is the only choice, i'll take that choice over not using my vote. like i say, i have more real heartburn over cindy's family than i do mccain's politics. hopefully he'll get a veto pen with a lotta ink, because he's gonna have a real liberal congress and senate. but so did Reagan, and he did ok. it's gonna be interesting. Lark.

they made the 600 in what is called a .350 rem mag. it has more recoil than the cartridges you listed. i think the action will take about anything. but i wouldn't remove any metal from any part of it that holds pressure. put a good brake on it and the recoil shouldn't be too bad. Lark.

bobbyo, because of the electoral college, your vote does count. it is one of, if not the most, brilliant things ever devised. it makes every state relevant in the presidential election. because of the electoral college, all gore isn't the president. not because of the crap in florida either. if he would have carried either his home state of tennesee or the clinton's home state of arkansas, florida wouldn't have mattered. but he didn't look at either state as worth his effort because they only have a couple electoral votes each. i ain't gonna go into a gov't lesson here, but the electoral college is set up so that new york, california and maybe one or 2 other big states don't elect every president. if it was just popular vote, that is exactly what would happen. because of the electoral vote and the way it spreads around electoral vote, every state has real improtance in the election. in 2000, it was the best example ever of how things work. the NRA bombarded tennesee and arkansas with anti-gore adds, more than any other state, and they swayed the vote in both places. and those 2 states turned the election. all we ever hear about is florida and hanging chads and a stolen election, but if gore would have spent some time in his home state, he would have won anyway. and in the florida, the system worked "EXACTLY" how it was supposed to. don't listen to the media BS. the electoral college is a great thing. go to wikipedia or some other good source and read up on it. i know they don't teach any of this stuff in school anymore, so if you got outta high school in the past 20 years, you may not know much about it. so educate yourself. the founding fathers were brilliant and inspired beyond comprehension. Lark.

that's purdy good fer casey. his fingers are sore from all the banjo practice and he can't type real well sometimes. Lark.

i don't think the founding fathers would be too happy about how things are now, but we're still light years ahead of the rest o' the world. it's gonna be interesting. i see now that condi rice is trying to politic into the vp with mccain. that's interesting. don't know how good it'd be, but it'd be interesting. main thing is to vote. Lark.

it only has about a 12 inch mainbeam. can't score too much. maybe it's a tule? Lark.

quiet muzzlebrakes are called silencers. Lark.

this country ain't in the crapper. it's so much better than any place else on earth that there is no comparison. even if we don't have real good choices for president, we have choices. and we have a congress and senate that have to listen to their voters. look at what happened a couple months ago when they tried the end around on the illegal alien amnesty deal. the folks got vocal and scared the crap outta congress and the senate and it got chunked in the trash. we have the system and the laws in place to keep us free and as long as folks stay brave enough to use their voice and vote and are smart enough to see what the big picture is, we'll be ok. obama and hillary are scary, but it's pretty apparent that niether one has much of a chance. mcain has his problems, especially when you look into his wife's family and the mob ties, but we, the voters, can keep him in check. obama is a joke. he hates America, he loves muslims, he hates white people, he hates guns, he hates anyone who has a good job, he even hates his own grandmother, and all that will be displayed very well come election time and Americans are smart enough to see it. hillary is a shreiking witch who hates herself, her life, her husband, everyone who works for her, etc., and it will all end up being displayed in full view. i think right now is a wonderful time for America because there is a real good chance that we'll be rid of the clintons for good. i'm sorta worried about mcain's family ties and how it will play out in the press, because so far they've left it alone. come the general election, i doubt that will happen. i'm looking forward to it myself, because there are lotta folks tied up in that deal that need exposed and need some mud flung on em. this is America at it's finest. the founding fathers were inspired by supreme forces when the consitution was written and when the supreme court and electoral college were formed, plus we have the checks and balances of congress and the senate. and we have state's rights to fend off stupid federal bs when it does come down. things ain't perfect, but they never are. as long as there are 2 people, there will be opinion differences. just have be unselfish and go with what is best for America. if you know something about American history and why the founding fathers did what they did, watching things like this is great. because it just reinforces the fact that this country is a divine place and our government was invented by inspired people. we have our warts, but i'll take warts over skin deep plastic surgery anyday. Lark.

whenever i put a wood stove in a house or cabin or camp trailer or whatever, i decide where i want it and put a magnetic torpedo level on the barrel o' my ol' .22, plumb it up and shoot through the roof. gives ya a perfect place to start cuttin'. i also drop a live chicken down the stove pipe when it needs cleanin'. Lark.

not mine. don't worry dude, he ain't gotta chance. if he beats out the shreaking witch, they'll just have him capped anyway. Lark.

man you need to have your own comedy show. or be a politician. never seen so much flipfloppin'. now a .338/.378 is too big? i guess i'll never figger it out. well, time to get ready for "MY" elk hunt. lemee, what'll i use, maybe a, well, maybe a .270. or would that be unethical?????????

there are a buncha leftover deer and sheep tags. Lark.

they're a good way to start, but plan on spending about 10x that by the time you're done. reloading is worse than meth. the kits will give you everything you need to start out and you can get a lot of experience before you move up into the real expensive drugs, i mean equipment. rcbs makes good stuff. Lark.

keep smilin' and slingin' big words, i'll keep draggin' in big elk. if i had to kill an elk and could take a gun over a bow, i'd take a .17 or a .223 or even a .22 long rifle. would not scare me a bit. just shoot em in the ear or the eye. something that i can do. but then again, i'm a sneaky guy. what my entire arguement is based on is you said a .280 is better than a .270, when they are so near identical there isn't a real arguement. none. their bullets in like weights perform so near identical there's no way to argue it. i've seen big bulls dropped in their tracks with a 100 gr .270 bullet in the lungs. it was out of a short mag going real fast, but it looked like a neck shot. real impressive. but under identical circumstances, ANY reasonable rifle would have done the same thing. i've seen perfect copper bullet lung shots with a .338/.378, a fairly big gun, as in good enough for rhinos and elephants, that ended up in an all nighter tracking with lanterns. you couldn't have drawn a better bullet location on a target. i know it would never have left the meadow even with a .243. my favorite elk rifle is a .300 mag. it's faster with bigger bullets. my kid killed a 6 point last year at 804 yards with his .300 ultra. even at that range, it went maybe 50 feet and died. go ahead, use copper bullets and drill a hole through em and trail em around for awhile. both blood trails go to the same elk. once again, shock, knockdown, whatever you wanna call it is just numbers on a piece of paper. if the paper says you have 2000 lbs of energy it means if you have a 2000 lb weight hanging from a rope, it will swing a foot when you hit it. it doesn't take into any account, the bullet, the animal, whether you're hitting bone or guts or whatever. it's just physics. every action has an opposite and equal reaction, E=MC2, all that einstein stuff. the animal you shoot doesn't know how fast the bullet is going or how hard it hits him. he doesn't go "crap, he shot me with a .338, 250 gr barnes going 2800 fps". he just runs until he dies. when a bullet is wadded up in a big ball under the skin on the off side, i know every bit of it's "shock" was left in the animal. not slung across the countryside after it goes through. on a lung shot a copper bullet zips through, doesn't do a lot of damage, and they run off and you have to track em. it kills em, but not very fast. the elk reaction reminds me a lot of using a muzzleloader. marksmanship is the only factor that really means much, when you're using a rifle suited to what you're hunting. Lark.

i guess i been doin' it wrong. instead o' tryin' to convert hippies, i always just beat em up. Lark.

i've had good luck with everyone i've ever had. most factory barrels seem to be real good. for me, el jippo douglas premiums are as good as any of em. if you're wanting to shave thousandths of an inch off your groups at long ranges, they may not be the best. but for hunting, they are fine. you can have any barrel contoured to however you want it. at least any decent gunsmith can do it. Lark.

if you want to throw a .17 in this discussion, you're losing all credibility. i would have to say that everyone would agree that it is not a realistic elk cartridge. heck, use a .25 auto pistol. it's legal. you can't kill an elk with one, but go ahead. and i know a guy who killed a nice bull with a .17 rem. did it on a bet. shot it in the ear. but if you're dumb enough to shoot one in the lungs with a 20 grain bullet, go ahead. you deserve the consequences. you'll track it for awhile and then give up. arrows and bullets don't kill differently. they cause blood loss and the animal dies, or you make a poor shot and they get away. they're just different ways of accomplishing the same thing. i have a lotta experience with em both. it wouldn't scare me to use a .243 for elk. not one bit. or an '06, a .300, a .270, a 7mm, a .338, .375, an ultra mag, etc. but i'd use a rifle with a good bullet and know how to shoot it. to automatically decide a .277 diameter bullet is "unethical" but a .284 is ok, ain't a valid arguement. there isn't enough difference in the 2 to matter. one is as good as the other. for some reason folks think if a bullet has an "mm" behind it, it is some kinda super gun. bet you didn't know that a .270 is a true 7mm, did ya? what we call a 7mm is actually a bit larger. europeans like to use the diameter of the bore inside the lands. .300's are a great elk round. killed several with mine. but none i couldn't have killed just as dead with my .270. and i ain't arguing that a .270 is the only option. but i get real sick of people starting this "unethical" crap and acting like there is some mythical formula that has to be followed to kill an animal. shoot it in the lungs, it dies. it's real simple. you just hafta be a good enough rifleman to do it. nothing makes up for poor shooting. and as far as copper bullets. get ready to track em. i've seen several hundred elk go down. i won't even hunt with someone who uses copper bullets anymore. only well hit elk i've ever had to track were shot with copper bullets. 3 in one week a while back. they died, but it sure took em awhile and it sure made a lotta work gettin' em out. the copper bullets seem to zip through em and don't shock em enough, i think. be good for brown bears, maybe in africa, but they ain't the best elk bullets, from my experience. Lark.

well, our gutless commission rolled. big article today in the paper and there is supposed to be a press release later. cabelas' high dollar lawyers scared the commission and they are gonna declare the draw "null and void", so they can load the lost cabelas app's and re-draw. i finally get an elk tag and this happens. there ain't no words for what i'm feelin' right now...........Lark.

if an animal is too far away for ya, get closer. oughta be easy for a bowhunter. a 300 yard shot ain't anything for any reasonable centerfire. if you hit an elk in the lungs with a .270, no matter the range or the bullet, it's a dead elk. simple fact. he might run off a little ways, but he's still dead. knockdown, trajectory, velocity, retained energy, etc, are nothin' but numbers on paper. and you can't kill anything with numbers on paper. knockdown and energy are mythical BS made to sell guns. they don't mean anything. a bullet of a specific weight going so fast gets a lbs/ft number attached to it and folks think it means something. well, a solid has the same number as a hollowpoint, of the same weight and velocity. but with drastically different effect when they get their. so do jacketed bullets, all copper bullets, partitions, etc. but they all work differently. the only thing to argue is accuracy and a good bullet. the gun don't matter, it's the nut holdin' the trigger. i get so sick and tired of folks arguing that this gun is ok for this and that gun is ok for that, when any of em are better than a bow and thousands of elk a year are killed with a bow. folks act like if a gun doesn't have the right numbers on paper, it isn't "ethical". once again, ethics are opinions, and opinions are like buttholes, everybody has at least one, and all of em but mine stink. i've killed a buncha elk with about anything there is. bow, rifle, muzzleloader, heck even a .30/30. if they had a season where all you could use was a busted whiskey bottle, i could kill one then too. it's the guy, not the gun. Lark.

well heck, either i'm losin' it or ya'll are gettin' smarter. and i know ya dummies ain't gettin' any smarter. the past couple o' years i managed to get at least a few folks mad enough to shoot somebody. buranuts was gonna shoot game wardens once over one april fool's joke. then i got death threats over another one. now this. i figgerd i could fool you idjuts any time. oh well, i'll hafta start workin' on next year. bcoover, don't worry, i do that a couple times a day anymore. some days more than others, depends...........Lark.

i ain't braggin', i'm just happy. it's good to be me. i've already killed more elk than bovine tuberculosis, so one more ain't a big deal. i'm just happy to be huntin' instead o' just guttin' for a change. Lark.