Ringer

I support the agency and have volunteered to work my butt off for a few projects. They do a good job IMO. I have hunted here for the last 52 years and other than the USO/SFW attack I can't remember when I was too worried about attacks on my rights to hunt. I did as much as I could on the lion initiative and you spent $250000. Where did that money go and just how did it beat back HSUS? Who controlled the spending? Was Wier's daughter's lobbying firm involved? That firm was hired by SFW and USO on the 2012 mess so hope not. This all started with the sky falling and we had to do something about HSUS. Just how did you people really beat them? Ask any hunter from Utah what happens when well intentioned people get hoodwinked into giving up precious tags to any group. It starts out just super duper then migrates to hundreds of tags and a huge SFW expo and a compromised G&F commission. Yes people will go back to sleep after they beat back an attack. That is just human nature. Not everyone is a groupie that makes a living from hunting.

I bought the cheap Chinese LED pop-ups a few years ago off EBAY. They are bright, lightweight, waterproof and work great. Couple of AA batteries and good to go. I will definitely have one in my pack for elk this year.

Stan- Nummie and I are going to listen and keep an open mind then vote NO! IDGAF, don't worry about the gentlemen's club environment. There will be more of us crude, rude old men there to balance it out. See you there.

I like TT's. You got a problem with that?

Anyone have an extra "Do Not Tread on Me" T-shirt or a "NO SFW" hat I can borrow for the meeting? I lost my ones from 2012. Thanks.

Makes no sense. We don't need an education program to convince a few thousand people that hunting is good. This entire discussion started with fighting HSUS and PETA groups on political issues. That would be politics. Tell us if they used the $250000 for the HSUS to sell their tag program to politicians. If not then how exactly did they use that money and what impact did it have on signature collecting? Name the firm they hired. They don't need to sell tags for education funds. They wanted to sell tags for political fights. No one has explained how that will work. Will it just generate funds for SFW to use for their political goals? If so then all of the groups better get in line to lick some boots. Too much secrecy on this one. Let's see and exact accounting of who got the money including any political contributions.

Write the commissioners, write the governor and write your legislators. Explain what is being attempted and the background from 2012 and the Utah facts. Best to get people at the top level of politics involved. The last time they used Jerry Wiers and his daughter so you know they have already plead their case to people at the top this time around. Write democrats and republicans and ask for them to look into this effort. Sunlight is the best way to kill parasites.

They have the majority on the new board so SFW will have control. I was already told that it was SFW that had the political expertise to run the tag program. If you think G&F will control all of the money you are a sucker. The money raised may go to some nefarious cause like HSUS or PETA but the management of the tag sales will be done by outfitters, rich girls and SFW. They still have not answered a single question on what the new group did with the $250000 to fight the lion initiative. So much for transparency. They want Arizona big game tags to auction off. That is all I need to know. Better rally the troops now as they are already trying to stack the commission like they did in Utah. Hope this phony train is not too far down the tracks.

That commission meeting is in Kingman on May 4th correct?

Twig- is that the only bullshit answer you have? If the groups decide to go for a lobbyist and hit the legislature I will be the first to donate $500 to the effort. Get enough of us to do that and it might just solve the problem forever without whoring out our tags. Someone already said they spent $250000 on the lion issue and still haven't said exactly how the money helped to stop people from signing the petition. Did they buy TV ads? Did they run magazine ads? I told my Romanian employees that the dirty HSUS hippies were from California and were pro abortion so they could get their 1000 church members to hassle people. Show us some details of how the $250000 helped. I think you are using the chicken little method to get tags for outfitters and SFW/SCI.

Since all of the old groups are in the new group why not find out the cost of hiring a good lobbying firm to introduce a bill in the legislature that would prevent Game and Fish from any ballot initiative? Not the lobby firm owned by Jerry Wier's daughter. I think that they can convince our leaders that wildlife management should be run by biologists and not outside special interest groups. That would slam the door forever on HSUS and PETA. Get the cost and solicit donations for the cause. Why keep fighting this instead of blocking it for good? They don't allow ballot initiatives to change the Arizona Revenue Department so same should apply.

Buddy was up there last weekend and the gobblers were talking a lot. Maybe the warm weather has them up early. Best bet is to go higher in the early morning and set him up under a tree in the dark and at first light make a few hen clucks with a box call. If one answers wait a while then call again and see if he is coming to you. They can cover a mile real fast. Have his gun up on his knees and ready to shoot. I usually use a mouth call when they get in sight.

They are gobbling like crazy as of last weekend so hope they are still horny when we hunt.

Rescue or Don if that is you. Show us Pete C's bank records and where he has been paid from since the last tag grab effort. They have enough members here to pay the staff? I doubt that. Don's name was mentioned in one of Jay's podcasts so he is in there somewhere. Yes I say AZSFW is exactly the same as SFW. Don tried to claim the way they were set up was different but that was bs last time. I guess we would know the details if SFW ever opened their books. People in Utah have been asking for that for the last ten years. Such a transparent bunch.

Say what you want but the guy is spot on. This entire deal is a ruse by SFW and their cronies. Last time they used USO and now they will use AZ outfitters. The goal is to privatize prime tags. HSUS is pure scare tactics. 100% bullshit that they stopped the initiative. Just how did their $250000 stop people from signing a petition? Think about that.

Here is an idea- get rid of Pete and Don and SFW and then come back with a more logical proposal that does not require raising 1.5 million dollars a YEAR for some fund for someone to spend on defending against something. This is just the second act in a long running play by SFW to force our prime tags into their control. People here that are listening to the new group are fools. Don Peay is against the American Model and has stated that in the past. He is a politician and represents the wealthy who just can't wait 20 years to hunt Arizona. You spent $250000 on this and claim you got the job done? That might be a retainer for a lobbying firm and just how did they help get rid of HSUS? How did your group stop people from signing the initiative? You didn't. This is just another excuse to take tags. JUST SAY NO.

We can never equal fundraising by HSUS. They constantly advertise on television and there are 90% more people who like furry animals than are hunters. If you want to make a difference get together and go to the legislature and get a bill passed to stop them from managing our wildlife through the ballot box. They will for sure try this again. I doubt that $5 million or higher will stop them if they have a hundred million to spend.

Utah was a similar situation. Don Peay and SFW used the wolf introduction as their tool to gain control of hundreds of prime tags. He and his boys were the only ones that could save the day. He is connected at the top levels of the state government and all the way to DC. HSUS here is the same deal. The sky is not falling but we all worked as we could to defeat the signature gathering. Now all of our groups are saying to trust the same people who once attempted to sue us for tags to sell. Is Jerry Wiers daughter's lobbying business part of this new push? He was a snake in the grass for sure. Just because the local groups say we have to do this doesn't mean we have to do it. Find another way to raise funds for a political pac to do that work. If we let them open the door for whoring big game tags we will find ourselves ruing the day we listened to the advocates. I vote NO!

Here is what I fear. Don Peay and his cronies basically used the wolf introductions to do the exact same thing they are using the HSUS deal here for. They claimed to be the salvation of hunters against the antis and ended up compromising the Game & Fish of Utah and getting their plants on the commission. A lot of well meaning people are doing the same thing here. Believing they have the political clout and only they can save us all. I am against allowing the whoring of our big game system for any reason including some phony excuse like HSUS. The new group did help but how much? If you saw the dirty assed hippy women gathering signatures in front of Whole Foods you would know it was a big climb for them from the start. The sky is not falling yet the groups here are saying it is. I am not falling for the trap. Let's figure out a way to raise funds needed without selling off our heritage to politicians and rich girly men.

I just talked to Andy from the sheep society. Good man and he explained the intent and how this is supposed to work. I still look at Utah and how Don Peay has taken over the state. He is a master politician and I don't really think a few tags will satisfy his people. I am afraid this will be the crack in the door to seeing our G&F compromised but that is just my feeling. I would go to the Hunttalk website and search on SFW Utah to get a better flavor of reality. I see a huge SFW Expo in our future. The HSUS issue was the perfect excuse for them to save us.

Where did they spend the money to fight HSUS? I never saw one post regarding any of that. I am sure all of the groups would love to get some tags for fundraising. Hunters here just don't trust the idea of selling big game tags that can take a non resident hunter 20 years to get in the system. Utah is the proof that this type of program can ruin a Game and Fish department. Why don't they just start a gofundme or some other vehicle to get donations for this political effort? They boasted that they had people willing and ready to write million dollar checks. If they would do that for the cause then why not get them to put their money where their mouths are? Or are they willing to write those big checks to buy premium big game hunts at will?

Show us one post regarding the HSUS issue where they were advocates. Show me the post on any hunting or fishing site announcing the group and their goals and where and when the meeting was to be held. Same people and same goal as last time. Will get the same result as soon as we can find enough tar and feathers.

I doubt that would be legal. If he killed the elk and tried to use your tag at all he is in deep doo. The tag came today and it is kind of cheesy. Big size and peel and stick plastic. A sharpie is the tool to sign it.

Pete was the greatest guy on earth last time when he was in the pocket of Don Peay. Same guy and same pocket. If he is in AZSFW he is the enemy of public land hunters who oppose giving tags out for any sort of fundraising. We are soon to hear what a super duper guy he is and how this new idea will benefit all of us. Look at Utah and how Peay lobbies politicians until he takes control of the commission. Yes they do some good projects but there is one goal and that is to allow the purchase of access to prime big game tags. Last time SCI and ADA came out for this crap before we all threw a fit. We need 40 voters with pitchforks at the May commission meeting. If Mother Theresa convinces us otherwise we can always stay home. Did anyone ask if Don Peay and SFW Utah is involved with any of this?

Ask him if Don Peay or SFW Utah is involved in any way at all. If he is then we will let the battle begin. That guy is a snake in the grass.