krp

Zim, I know you from MM and can say you are one of the good guys. Kent

Again, the issues of 2006 to 2009 we are still dealing with and I'm glad G&F are reversing some of them. It's not a coincidence that the Peak of the Nappy commission and the advent of a new path of supposed leadership of the orgs 'azsfw' had hostile clashes. Eventually having orgs like ADA asking unaffiliated folks to address the commission because they were effectively blackballed... for hostile personal statements of commission members it seems. I'm not blaming this commission or politics for that fiasco and they seem to be silently cleaning it up and we need to help on our end of 'Sportsmen groups and individuals'. Kent

Let me add this, I've noticed a pattern with azsfw... create a wedge between the dept/commission and hunters... bad commission/good commission... they want us to believe any commission is bad so they can justify taking over management of tags. They are now attempting to drive a wedge between us and our legislators and Governor... The same ones we applaud for sticking their finger in Obama's face and stand up for us on a federal level. That's not going to work either, I'm not going to fall for that and start cussing my Governor... we need to keep up the steady march forward and not get sidetracked. Kent

Couple of things... this commission isn't the Nappy commission of 08'. The hostilities of that commission can be directly related to the rise of azsfw and their tactics of relationship with that commission, especially the appointment of Martin. Statistics can be manipulated to support any view or stance. The depts numbers above are just to refute the premise of a specific stance of azsfw's. Here's my statistic with the same numbers of azsfw... in the last 20 years the chart indicates a dramatic decrease of wildlife and permits while there has been a continue increase in nonprofit wildlife organizations, members and fundraising. If you think mine is silly, think about azsfw's... Kent

George... who they should be comparing themselves to are Jesse Jackson and Acorn. Kent

If Weiers can walk the halls of the legislature and fight against this new push, as he said in the interview, he would fight it. That'll be hard to overcome politically as he was the original sponsor and main man for azsfw in the past. Kent

I myself am willing to give Weiers the benefit, we asked him to reconsider and he has publicly, what else can we except from a man. Now if it changes again in the future, so can we. Kent

Nice job Allen... figured they would keep it short. Kent

5500 is probably as many as all the state critter members total... there can't be 200 people that support this legislation that actually read it... counting their uncle fred who's 90 with dementia. Anyway, who else wonders how Allen did without a keyboard as a crutch... hope they at least let him use a teleprompter... I'm gett'n his autograph next time I see him, now that he's a TV star. can't wait to watch tonight amigo. Kent

Hope we do the Big'o'bbq before I have to go... I'd like to meet all these folks and thank them. Kent

John this is not colo and just less than 80% of Az, that's not rez, is public land. Include the metro areas in the 20% private and you are talking about a very small area of huntable private land. Access to public land blocked by private should be a state or federal resolved issue, that they won't seek compliance is just a reflection of our country's demise into socialism. Anyway, how many of these private areas that will hold 10 to 15 hunters are in the state? so we can have a better understanding of the cost to benefit ratio is if we have to pay ransom. How many can be accessed by foot same as a wilderness? how much of the 20% minus the metro hold huntable populations? You can't just talk generally, you have to bring some statistics. Then how is spending HPC monies on ransom going to increase the number of tags available? And for those in favor of these new tags and expo... how will that make a difference? Kent

It seems to me there was a system started by G&F to create some dollars for conservation, auction tags. Most of us didn't pay attention besides thinking if we won the lottery, hey it'd be fun. I couldn't have told you who bought a tag or if the same guy did multiple times, seems outrageous but a man's money is his to do spend. Now having been forced to look, the system has been taken over by a select few as far as purchase, but at least it was still G&F collecting the monies for the HPC. Now those same ones are now attempting to be the payers, collectors and spenders of the monies... cutting the G&F and HPC out. Kent

And the money comes right back to the organizations that he has part control of, pretty good gig.... bypassing G&F... who in reality are the ones 'raising' money for conservation by 'selling' tags... Another ethical dilemma... how can you be the seller and buyer of a 'public' resource. Kent

Yea... I'm just trying to wrap my brain around how AH paid for the project we've worked on. the examples of auction tags can't be right as he paid for a tag, that tag had value and would sell to someone, once the money exchanges hands then that money belongs to someone else to spend in the next cycle of purchases... that's how economy works. If he donated funds for a specific project without compensation, like we do on our unaffiliated jr hunts, then that's understandable and he should get credit. But that wasn't the way it was described in this thread... Buying a tag isn't doing anything but buying a tag and if a Rez tag/hunt is worth 40 grand then a 365 day anywhere tag is worth multiple times more on it own merit. Kent

I'm having a hard time finding where any of the auction or raffle tag monies are officially charity donations as in Tax deductible. If it is a purchase, then it's a transaction with both parties getting value, or in the raffle, a gamble for value same as the rez casino. If it's not tax deductible then throwing out the word donation is disingenuous. Kent

AH got a tag for his money, a tag he can only get with money... that's it. if he's also volunteered working on projects then he can claim that, same as the rest of us. If he donates money into the HPC direct with no reimbursement he can claim that. If he props up azsfw with money that's a political PAC lobby, he can't claim that as conservation. Kent

Now don't actually bring real math into it... geeze An expo would cost millions, raise millions in tag monies... wanna bet if there would be any left on the ledger after the big party and all got their tags... Kent

That's great Allen! Kent

Math wise, you could charge 5 bucks as a habitat stamp when buying a hunting or fishing license, excluding youths, and generate about the same dollars than the current auction tags. Now though I believe there are issues with the draw the way it's evolved with the 20% pass draw and the 1-2 general draw and the maturity of bonus points... there is something about 'tradition' and the draw evolved through time to this tradition, are there better or just as good options, possibly. The tradition of the auction tags has merit... but it isn't the only way or possibly even the best way if push comes to shove. I've said before that this group pushing 2072 is also risking the current auction tags in future court battles... it's a stupid risk. Kent

I'm neither hot nor cold on the current auction tags... I'll never buy one or guide one to make money off of. In the current system they go 100% to the G&F into the HPC system from what I understand, I assume this means it's only for conservation use. If there were no auction tags I truly wouldn't care. In the new system tags would be removed from units out of the general draw and sold, the money would go to a private interest group that would spend it anyway they want, "including' transferring over a percentage to a political PAC organization for lobbying politicians. This is what our political systems have decayed to in this country, buying legislation. It's truly abhorrent. Kent

Gov Brewer was the cohost last year at the azsfwc banquet and also was at the azsfw banquet when Palin came a couple years ago, she has a relationship already built. I think we have covered this before. It's a difficult situation in that we wanted her support before and got it... now we want her to disavow that very support. One of the reasons I truly despise politics involved in conservation, the mix can turn on you in a split second. I don't blame Gov Brewer in this, I blame sfw for backstabbing us. Kent

coueshunter is only a keyboard commando all type and no do... lol Kent

Someone needs to qualify what is considered a personal attack around here... the swearing is self evident. Someone can call me a conspiracy theorist (nice words for liar)... and then go back on what they say and be called a liar (bad word for conspiracy theorist)... Who was personally attacked on what ended up being truth? Beliefs only go so far before 'truth' turns them into a lie... opps, I meant conspiracy theories. Kent

Amen brother... I truly hate fear mongering... I think lobbying has ruined this country and taken what little voice of the people away... there's no such thing as a constituency anymore...3% of the populace fought against tyranny in the revolution that created this country and won... of the 97%, Some still wanted it, some didn't care, some did. our 3% against their .01% who are actually going to fight not just hide behind the curtains... let's win again. Kent

Yes... I'd save money if I boycotted all sporting goods departments, all Salt river lakes, well all az lakes, shooting facilities, the G&F draw... and Dunkin donuts... Kent