Flingingarrowsbro

sent pm

Yes I guess we can agree to disagree. And just because I used to work for ASLD doesnt mean I agree with how the look and deal with management of state trust land. Yes I have seen overgrazing as well, and yes I make observations with my own eyes. I guess what it really comes down to, its hard to see someone who hunts a few hunts a year, dictate and think their recreation trumps someones livelihood. Like someone stated earlier, there are plenty of options to hunt and camp somewhere else. Happy hunting

If it falls thru, let me know

https://journals.uair.arizona.edu/index.php/rangelands/article/view/12129/11407

Here is a study to look at, one of many. This one in particular shows the areas that had no grazing had the least amount of diversity and was over run by cactus. https://www.ars.usda.gov/ARSUserFiles/30180000/Hart/25.%20Hart%202001.pdf

For reference, moderate stocking rate shoots for 35-50% utilization.

1uofacat, I will try to address each of your points. Through all of this, my attempt is for you to look at the whole picture. I hunt coues every year, I have 2 daughter and a wife that all killed a coues the last 2 years and love to hunt myself. I have a daughter who also has an elk tag this winter. I love to hunt as much as anyone. I want access like everyone else. I also worked for ASLD as a range specialist in the past. I saw first hand how much work had been done in the past to calculate carrying capacity for each permit. There is a 20+ study the Arizona Land Dept and AZGFD has been doing on the Chevrolet butte, diablo canyon and flying M ranches on the effects and and overlap of grazing of cattle and elk. Moderate stocking rates do not have a negative effect on elk. ASLD has set grazing now numbers at moderate levels. Heavy grazing isnt good for any animal, cattle included. Looking at one side of the fence, thats not misinformation, thats ignorance. The side that has cattle will obviously have less forage. But has it occurred to you that the side that looks better was also grazed the year before and depending on the rotation hasnt been grazed yet that year? Also many studies across the West show moderate grazing has a positive impact on forages. The highs of the cattle market was about a 2 year isolated event, that was the exception not the norm. Like I said, your everyday rancher is not getting rich, if they get 2-3% ROI that is considered doing well. Cattle cannot ruin a hunt. There is so much access and huntable areas that if your reasoning is cattle make your hunting area bad then you are not trying too hard. Working at ASLD, I have seen solar panels stolen, wiring pulled from wells, and storage tanks shot to pieces. Vandalism to one storage tank could cost 5k. One cow that is shot is 1k. The first time you had to pay 5k for a new storage tank would make you pretty upset, after the second and third, just imagine the anger you would feel. I used to deal with those issues on a weekly basis. I guarantee after you lost 15k due to a few bad apples, you wouldnt be so welcoming.

1uofacat, What is State BLM land you keep referring to? Full grown cattle are worth $1500-2000? A pair is worth $1100 at the moment. A 2yr old maybe $900 Ranchers state grazing fees are low compared to a private lease, but they provide so many benefits in terms of stewardship that the state could never afford. (Thousands upon a thousands of miles of pipelines, wells and troughs that sustain wildlife populations) The State sets the amount of livestock each permit can carry. What you may think is overgrazing, judging by all the other misinformation you have, probably isnt as overgrazed as you think. It does not benefit someone to overgraze, it costs too much to feed hay and hurts the resale value of the ranch if they were ever to sell. Throw out the rich hobby ranchers that buy ranchers for tax write-offs or the generational ranchers who have had ranchers in the family for the last hundred years, I dont know a lot of wealthy or even middle class ranchers. Many are scraping by from year to year. I imagine if you owned a state grazing lease you would prefer people not camp on the land you lease either. The littering and vandalism that occurs would drive you absolutely crazy.

yeah, 1 and done. still imagine a few hundred point guards will be used this year

that's good news. just hope they don't tell us 3 days before hunt starts if we get a tag

I wonder how many people will use their point guard this year?

Hunted 12 days in 27. Didn't hear a bugle till the 3 rd morning, called in two raghorns. didn't hear a bugle for almost another 7 days. Didn't see rutting activity till the night of the 10th day. Last 4 days it really picked up and there was good bugling if you could find them. I hunted all over looking for bugles, drove at night, early in the morning. spotlighted, went to south end of unit, went to north end of the unit. went into the blue wilderness area. Talked to a lot of hunters and saw a lot of depressed faces. Ended up treating the hunt like a coues hunt. Glass then spot and stalk

Just listened to Jed Morrison at a concert. That guy is awesome !

thanks pelapapas. It all depends on who you call. Call Yuma office.

So I called and found out I picked up a leftover tag. No big deal right? wrong. I was picked for my last choice (4th choice). I called to clarify. I was told that my choices 1-3 had already filled up. They had over 4000 tags come in over the weekend. My first choice was all coues in this order ( 32,29,35b, 36a). Normally I only put two choices and I ALWAYS get my first choice. There are gonna be a lot of people that were counting on a leftover tag and not get to go hunting this year.