Bull elk in 6A

[jackmedic]

I was lucky enough to be drawn for bul elk in 6A Nov hunt this year, and will be using my T/C Omega 50 cal. I am relatively new to muzzle loader hunting, but really enjoy it so far.

I am looking for some ideas on bullet size, powder type, and any other tips that I can use.

 

Thanks,

Jackmedic

[WalkingW]

Congrats that is a great tag!!

Try to stay away from the sabots they just do not have the penetration. I know there will be someone that will say I am wrong but the more weight the better. And most important is to close your distance!!!!! Do not shoot at an elk over 125 with that thing they are way overrated just ask any good meat processor they will tell you how many rounds they find in elk. You might be able to hit them but not kill them. Another thing to take note of is your wind age. Wind drift is very hi at any distance. As to find what is right for your rifle that just takes time on the range. I have found that most of my friends that shoot zip rifles try to stay away from any plastic on their rounds it tends to melt to the sides of your barrels Causing tough reloads and inaccuracy. I have two friends that prefer the old fashion mini ball in their zip rifles.

If you want to have something a little better that is also a great investment go out and buy a original and shoot round balls. You might be amazed how well they shoot, and it is real cool to take you game with a rifle that is over 160 years old. That is what that season was for.

Take into consideration that alot of companies boast thing that are just flat not true of their products just to sell them.

Good luck on your hunt

 

[rogeti]

We have had pretty good luck with Powerbelts. the make them in 348 grain and 405 grain.

[fatfootdoc]

Hmm, I have never had issues with sabots. Loaded with buckhorn 209 120 gr and federal 209 primers. TMZ spitfires(have to switch to EZ since the tolerances on the omegas are to close and was hard to load the sabots. ) But accurate as heck out to 250 with leupold muzzleloader scope. I have never had any issues and as a matter of preference would not use round balls. If you have the means to shoot the new stuff do it. However I also respect those who like to shoot round balls, just not my cup of tea. Oh and I also shoot a TC Omega and love it!! Good luck I have seen some nice bulls in that unit should be a good hunt. AG

[HaYen]

I've been trying a lot of different projectiles (Sabot and Conicals) out of my CVA Optima Elite. It too has very tight tolerances. Sabots have their pluses and minuses. On the plus side, for a 50 caliber ML they are usually .45 cal (.451), thus lighter, faster, flatter, you get the point. On the minus they don't get as heavy as their counter part and some feel the Sabot is just another point of failure (I've seen a guy shoot a Saboted bullet and watch the berm to his 9 o'clock get hit). Some feel the Conicals bullet-to-bore nature give them an advantage (theory by the guys at Bad Bull Muzzle loaders)

 

Here are a few I recently shot:

 

Thor bullets are conicals formed by (made by) Barnes for Thor. They use to send out a sample pack of sizes ranging from .500 - .506. Their latest offering is slightly over-sized, but coated for easier loading. I haven't used these new ones yet, but the folks that have said to give them a good wack to get started down the bore and you're good to go. The .501 original Thor hit exactly where I was aiming. Oh and there non-leaded.

 

Parker Productions makes a Traditional Hunter and HydroCons conicals. They also make Sabot bullets; more on those below. I really like these conicals with 100grs of Pyrodex. At 60 yards, I clover leafed a 5 shot group. Swabbing the barrel every other shot. These were special cast to .501 by Bob Parker and come with their own over the powder wads.

 

Powerbelts are great for the tight barrels. No fuss no muss, but I would caution using 120grs of anything with them especially the newer BPS. Over push these bullets and they will fail.

 

Hornady makes the FPB in either 350 or 300grs. These conicals look like SST's without the Sabot. I can't speak on their performance, as I was told they are slightly larger than .501, thus why try right?

 

The last conical I've tried is the lightest this company offers for a 50 cal and comes in at a mere 460grs. Its by a company called NoExcuse. Now I will say that I'm still trying to find a load for this conical. I've tried it with and without an over the powder wad, with 100grs of Pyrodex and 2 pellets of White Hots. So far the White Hots gave me ... a group. Also, it seems the first shot out of a cold barrel is a flier and it doesn't like the barrel to be swabbed after every shot only after every other shot. The over the powder wads I have (made of felt) leave a crust ring on the inside that makes it difficult to seat another bullet. Next I'm going to try 80grs of BH209.

 

By the way, even though your ML is rated for 150grs, the guys over at Western advise against going over 120grs of BH209.

 

As for Saboted bullets:

 

Barnes groups are nice and are 50 State legal. I shoot the MZ/TMZ. Their hard to get down the pipe but do kill.

 

Parker productions also sent me some HydoCon Saboted bullets. The Sabots made getting these down the bore difficult until Harvester sent me some Crushed Ribbed Sabots and right down the pipe they went. What a beautiful group; just one really big hole. The guys at Max Muzzle Loader perform independent test on ML equipment and they really like these bullets.

 

Speaking of Harvester, they sent me some of their Saboted PT Gold bullets along with some spare Sabots. Again, these bullets shot a really tight, large hole with 100grs of Pyrodex.

 

Finally, I recently purchased (can you believe it they made me buy them) some Extreme Elites from the guys over at MuzzleLoadingBullets.com in Canada. So far so good. I did have to special order them with the three pedal Sabot for easier loading. And they sure were easier to load.

 

There are so many good offerings out there. Of the ones I've tested I really can't tell you which one I'll use on my next hunt. For Javilina I'll go with one of the lighter 45 caliber offerings while big game will probably get 460grs of McLovein if I can find a load.

 

 

There are a ton of other projectiles out there. Some I've tried and didn't mention them about because I didn't have much success with them others because I just haven't tried them.

 

As a side note, Traditional vs In-line. I don't really put them in the same class. They both have their advantages and disadvantages. I love them both.

 

Good luck on your hunt!!! Post pics when you get back

 

BJ

[DesertBull]

Try the Dead Center's.

 

http://www.prbullet.com/pts.htm

 

http://www.prbullet.com/

[jackmedic]

Thank you everybody for all the information.

I appreciate the feedback and definitely hope to have some nice pics to post come late November...until then I will find the best bullet/powder combo for my T/C Omega!

[bobbyo]

The best bullet is the one that shoots the best. That includes sabots. Hayen 120 grains loose equals 150 grain pellet. The 150 grain in pellet only has 120 grains of powder. How do they get away with calling it 150 grain, Well they say their pellets are equivalent to 150 grains of blackpowder.

[billrquimby]

Except for shooting a bison in Colorado with an original Alex Henry rifle made in Scotland in the mid-1800s, all my experience in muzzleloading hunting was with replicas of percussion and flintlock Hawken and Pennsylvania longrifles that I'd built.

 

We stopped using round balls after a friend and I shot a dozen or so little Texas Hill Country whitetails with them. The round balls penetrated well, but every deer ran at least 100 yards before dropping. Some of them ran a lot more than that. We never lost a deer, but some were hard to find in the high grass and brush on the ranches we hunted.

 

With heavier bullets and miniballs, most of our deer dropped on the spot or ran only twenty yards or so.

 

As for the bison, the Alex Henry English sporting rifle shot a 45-caliber 500-grain bullet (patched with paper) clear through the animal and killed it instantly. The distance was about 45 yards.

 

We also learned that for best accuracy the projectile must match the barrel's twist. Long twists shot patched round balls best. Short twists required bullets or miniballs. This was before Pyrodex came along, and we used only black powder.

 

Our absolute maximum range for accuracy was perhaps 75 yards, and most of the deer we killed were 50 yards or closer. That wasn't a problem. Over the ten years we hunted there with muzzleloaders, the two of us must have shot 40-50 deer, maybe more. Depending on the year, the limit was three or four deer per person and we never went home without taking our limits.

 

Bill Quimby

[HaYen]

The best bullet is the one that shoots the best. That includes sabots. Hayen 120 grains loose equals 150 grain pellet. The 150 grain in pellet only has 120 grains of powder. How do they get away with calling it 150 grain, Well they say their pellets are equivalent to 150 grains of blackpowder.

 

Is that all pellets on the market?

[Couesdeer]

I only tried two different bullets when working up a load for my muzzleloader. I settled on a 285 gr Barnes Expander MZ over 100 Gr of 777. In my muzzleloader, they were much more accurate than the powerbelts i tried.

Killed a small bull elk in '07 with that particular combo. 125 yards, broadside shot through both lungs, breaking a couple of ribs on the way out. The elk stumbled about 10 yards and died right there.

 

[bobbyo]

The best bullet is the one that shoots the best. That includes sabots. Hayen 120 grains loose equals 150 grain pellet. The 150 grain in pellet only has 120 grains of powder. How do they get away with calling it 150 grain, Well they say their pellets are equivalent to 150 grains of blackpowder.

 

Is that all pellets on the market?

 

 

I know it is true for Pyrordex and 777. I did the math and at least a couple years ago you paid about twice as much for the pellets as for the same amount of powder. I use 100 grains of loose which is a convenient size and my gun likes it. This is equal to 125 grains in pellets. 100/120: 125/150.

 

http://www.nodakoutdoors.com/forums/viewto...=97&t=66729

[Couesdeer]

Thanks for the heads-up on that, Bobbyo. I reckon I could make a few phone calls to the manufacturer and determine equivilancies between 777 powder and pellets. The pellets seemed to go up a couple of bucks each time I purchased them over the last few years.

[HaYen]

From Hodgdon's website:

 

Triple Seven is a high energy product designed to provide the muzzleloading hunter with higher velocities when used in the same VOLUME as blackpowder. To duplicate a blackpowder load velocity using Triple Seven, you must decrease the powder charge by 15%. *See WARNING below.

 

Pyrodex is lighter in weight than blackpowder and weighs only about 70% as much as blackpowder. However, because Pyrodex yields more energy per pound than does blackpowder, the same volume of Pyrodex gives similar performance to blackpowder. Pyrodex loads given in this manual for muzzleloading guns are measured by volume, not weight.

 

The full article can be found here.

 

They also have a PDF document with load and velocity data. Click this LINK and they'll ask you to check box the disclaimer first. Triple Seven Magnum is not listed. I'm told BH209 has about as much energy as 777 Magnum and Black Mag 3 (a.k.a Black Dot) although Alliant is playing with that recipe.

 

[bustedknuckleinc]

I used the 300 gr barnes on my elk hunt last year. They performed great. I used the T/C omega as well.