ADA decision

[Non-Typical Solutions]

I was sent the survey and wished I had copied the questions. I believe there were only 3 questions. 2 of the questions I thought were trick questions and told them so on a written reply on the back of the survey. It was worded to think you would want to say yes to helping wildlife but actually meant you were agreeing with azsfw. I can see how it might have gotten a 50/50 vote. Something like when you vote on a ballot on election day and it reads one way but means another. I feel it should have just said do you agree or not with what azsfw tried to do. Just my opinion.

 

TJ

Isn't that how most surveys are when those putting out the survey don't really want the answer??

Reminds me of the AIMS tests for our AZ state standards

[elkaholic]

When is the ADA gonna get off their "aces" and come forward with information about the platnium membership with the azsfw .

 

The sportsmen and women of Arizona deserve an Answer -

 

whats it gonna take for this to happen!?

 

we've been told twice the 2072 push is dead - we'vew been told that if it happened a second time the ADA would remove itself from affiliation.

 

WHat is the message they are sending by dragging this out - with no comment from anyone !

[ThomC]

They have already spoken. Ask ole BPJ.

[muskrat]

The sportsmen and women of Arizona deserve an Answer

 

Not taking sides, but I think the only people who "deserve" an answer, are members of the ADA. An answer might be useful for prospective members or the general public to form an opinion on the group, but I don't think people who are not members are "owed" anything by the group. If the "sportsmen and women" of Arizona are that concerned with what any group says or does, then they should be members of said group.

 

(Not saying you're a member or not, just saying)

[azelkhunter2]

The only people the ADA or any of the other ORGS owe an answer too is thier current members or potential new members. If a individual does not agree with the way ANY of the orgs conducts itself or the way it makes decisions it has a right to give it's money and time to the org that it feels best supports their intrest. That individual also has the right to tell anyone that will listen what thier thoughts and opinions are. Who and how the ADA and the other orgs choose to support is up too it's members and board of directors no more no less. If any of the members of the ADA feel like they are not getting the answers they rightfully deserve they by all meens should demand answers if they still dont get them they have the right to take their money and support elsewhere. If an org does not do right by it's members they will fail. What WE ALL need to remember is that are opinions are just that ARE opinions. There are over 200.000 sports men / women in this state = 200.000 DIFFERENT thoughts / agendas / wants and needs.

[bonuspointjohn]

When is the ADA gonna get off their "aces" and come forward with information about the platnium membership with the azsfw .

 

The sportsmen and women of Arizona deserve an Answer -

 

whats it gonna take for this to happen!?

 

we've been told twice the 2072 push is dead - we'vew been told that if it happened a second time the ADA would remove itself from affiliation.

 

WHat is the message they are sending by dragging this out - with no comment from anyone !

The final results of the survey are in an will be published in our newsletter. We owe it to our membership to give them the information of the survey. I have read that there were "trick Questions" in the survey. There were 3 questions. Question 1 was "Are you for the ADA continuing to support the AZSFW?" If you can discover the tricky part, please advise Amanda, since she helped craft some of the questions. As far as the AZSFW, it will continue to exist, but in a far different format and certainly without funding from any of the conservation groups, including the ADA. There is a HB in the legislature which is designed around what can or cannot be said on the internet. I hope that it does not garner support, but CWT would be an interesting place to visit if it does. I must admit that the silver lining is that some people have come out and gotten involved. Don Lee is a good example of what can happen when people get off their collective backsides and get to rolling up their sleeves. I attempted to call all those who voted to NOT support the AZSFW only to thank them for participating in the process. Some folks did not place their names or addresses on the return vote or envelope, but those that did I attempted to contact. As far as responding to CWT, I apologize, but we really do owe you nothing. The ADA will have their annual election in June and we are looking forward to our members attending and having new board members on the slate for a 2 year commitment. Regard, BPJ

[azelkhunter2]

Sorry did not see the other post like mine it was posted as my post was being typed.

[archerycrazy]

Thanks for clearing things up John. You are correct about Donnie Lee and the small silver lining of the HB 2072 fiasco.

We have a new small group forming, SWSA, that is willing to put their blood, sweat and tears into the conservation effort. Most were at the ADA Board meeting at BassPro. Some will be doing the water project on 442 on the 28th.

 

George

[donniedent]

John and George, thanks for the nice words.

 

Honestly, I'm only fore front on this deal because of my big mouth and my lack of fear of looking stupid. There are a lot of guys out there a lot smarter and more expirienced that me. My true passion is for wildlife and to see guys my age involved.

 

Its easy for us Joes to stand back and watch from afar. We see certain things happen we may not like and we start to make assumtions about intentions. As my involvement grows and as I'm able to speak to various leaders in orgs, I'm realizing that its not some ritzy job where you're rubbing shoulders with the elite. Its a lot of personal sacrifice with time, money and truck loads of frustration. Anyone in this state that is leadership in an org is there because they LOVE wildlife. There is truly no glory in it as far as I can see. And while I may have a different opinion on how things should happen, its very reassuring to see that all of these leaders are at least passionate about wildlife. If you want to deal with 100's of emails, phone calls every night till 10 o'clock, people bashing you on the inernet without being able to truly speak your mind because of who you represent and complete apathy from 90 percent of the people you are trying to help.... Step up and try and lead an org. Believe me when I say all of this guys because I'm just like you all and as regular joe as they come.

 

Legislation will come and go, battles with antis will come and go and leaders we don't agree with will come and go but the true evil that is constant and the one we should truly fear is our own apathy.

 

Donnie

[Ringer]

I like the idea of the new group and would be at the project on the 28th if it wasn't for my turkey hunt. Keep us informed and we will see if we can get more people involved. I have worked projects with G&F in the past but not for a few years. As far as some house bill telling people they can't bully ADA or AZSFW that one is a laugh. The day we can't get riled up to stop a bunch of thieves from raiding the henhouse is the day I will gladly take a dirt nap. This ain't France yet.

[donniedent]

There are a lot of guys inluding guys from the dept that won't make it because of the turkey hunts. No big deal at all. If I had a tag that's where I'd be.

[ThomC]

When is the ADA gonna get off their "aces" and come forward with information about the platnium membership with the azsfw .

 

The sportsmen and women of Arizona deserve an Answer -

 

whats it gonna take for this to happen!?

 

we've been told twice the 2072 push is dead - we'vew been told that if it happened a second time the ADA would remove itself from affiliation.

 

WHat is the message they are sending by dragging this out - with no comment from anyone !

The final results of the survey are in an will be published in our newsletter. We owe it to our membership to give them the information of the survey. I have read that there were "trick Questions" in the survey. There were 3 questions. Question 1 was "Are you for the ADA continuing to support the AZSFW?" If you can discover the tricky part, please advise Amanda, since she helped craft some of the questions. As far as the AZSFW, it will continue to exist, but in a far different format and certainly without funding from any of the conservation groups, including the ADA. There is a HB in the legislature which is designed around what can or cannot be said on the internet. I hope that it does not garner support, but CWT would be an interesting place to visit if it does. I must admit that the silver lining is that some people have come out and gotten involved. Don Lee is a good example of what can happen when people get off their collective backsides and get to rolling up their sleeves. I attempted to call all those who voted to NOT support the AZSFW only to thank them for participating in the process. Some folks did not place their names or addresses on the return vote or envelope, but those that did I attempted to contact. As far as responding to CWT, I apologize, but we really do owe you nothing. The ADA will have their annual election in June and we are looking forward to our members attending and having new board members on the slate for a 2 year commitment. Regard, BPJ

 

 

Well ol BPJ doesnt owe CWT anything but doesnt hesitate to USE CWT to promote his agendi. Typical all for me and the h for you.

[donniedent]

I wasn't planning on jumping back into this but here I am.

 

As far as the ADA or any org owing the general public an answer.... They don't represent the general public. Orgs represent their members, members who PAY to be represented. Now, if the ADA chose to share where they stand, great.

 

If I truly represented an group and did not have my own agenda, none of you would know what I thought about 2072. If I were the president and I was asked about 2072, I might privately tell you what I personally think but I would not post my opinion on a public forum. If you truly represent your members, then you poll or survey your members and when you have the results you publicly post those results and say "The org I represent favors/doesn't favor such and such legislation"

 

For John to get up here and say that ADA does or does not favor HB2072 before he knows where the people he represents stand, would be a dis-service to those same people. Each org has to decide how they handle such matters. Do they trust their leadership to speak for them without a poll, if so great. If not, it is imperative you know the opinion of your membership before you give an answer. Anything less would be misrepresentation. I'm not here to defend John or the ADA, I'm sure John and I don't agree on everything but I absolutely agree that if you aren't a paying member, you don't deserve any answers. Its our collective apathy that allowed this to happen, so for anyone try and pin an org down for answers is hypocritical. If we want answers to why this happened we can all take a long look in the mirror.

 

No matter where you stand on HB2072, its time to find common ground and move forward. If you don't like how the ADA or any other org has handled things... Its very simple, don't join them. But realize, they are here and not going anywhere soon, the best thing we can do for our culture is to move forward and work together. This back and forth needs to stop.

 

BTW, if you are unafiliated and want your voice to be heard, I believe there is a meeting of the Sportmans contituent group on May 8th. I sure I will see you all there. Lots of opinions will be heard and it will make a difference, unlike this kind of dialog.

 

Donnie

[Non-Typical Solutions]

I wasn't planning on jumping back into this but here I am.

 

As far as the ADA or any org owing the general public an answer.... They don't represent the general public. Orgs represent their members, members who PAY to be represented. Now, if the ADA chose to share where they stand, great.

 

If I truly represented an group and did not have my own agenda, none of you would know what I thought about 2072. If I were the president and I was asked about 2072, I might privately tell you what I personally think but I would not post my opinion on a public forum. If you truly represent your members, then you poll or survey your members and when you have the results you publicly post those results and say "The org I represent favors/doesn't favor such and such legislation"

 

For John to get up here and say that ADA does or does not favor HB2072 before he knows where the people he represents stand, would be a dis-service to those same people. Each org has to decide how they handle such matters. Do they trust their leadership to speak for them without a poll, if so great. If not, it is imperative you know the opinion of your membership before you give an answer. Anything less would be misrepresentation. I'm not here to defend John or the ADA, I'm sure John and I don't agree on everything but I absolutely agree that if you aren't a paying member, you don't deserve any answers. Its our collective apathy that allowed this to happen, so for anyone try and pin an org down for answers is hypocritical. If we want answers to why this happened we can all take a long look in the mirror.

 

No matter where you stand on HB2072, its time to find common ground and move forward. If you don't like how the ADA or any other org has handled things... Its very simple, don't join them. But realize, they are here and not going anywhere soon, the best thing we can do for our culture is to move forward and work together. This back and forth needs to stop.

 

BTW, if you are unafiliated and want your voice to be heard, I believe there is a meeting of the Sportmans contituent group on May 8th. I sure I will see you all there. Lots of opinions will be heard and he will make a difference, unlike this kind of dialog.

 

Donnie

 

Place and time donnie??

Thanks..........

[donniedent]

May 8th and I'm trying to find out where. I will post here when I find out. If its here in the valley I will deffinately be there If its not here then I'm not sure I'll be able to make it. I'll darn sure try though.

 

Donnie