Scooter Report post Posted December 12, 2011 Why on Earth is there no Doe Harvest here??? I have not been here long, but every other state I've hunted has antlerless tags (for deer). Seems like everywhere I go I see them. If you can only shoot 1 deer per year, I don't see the harm in that one deer being a slickhead. Can anyone school me on this subject? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 12, 2011 Az just doesn't have many deer to start with. This is the desert. Lark. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scooter Report post Posted December 12, 2011 I see them everywhere I go- this cannot possibly be true. I trust ya Lark, but from where I'm glassing it's like at least a 10:1 ratio... Heck, yesterday I stalked up on 20 Muley does in a group and no antlers in sight... With that logic (not having many deer in AZ), and the buck/doe ratios how much sense does it make to shoot bucks only??? Like I said... I'm still learning here in AZ, and I'm certainly not a biologist- just seems like there's an imbalance from what I've seen down here. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JLW Report post Posted December 12, 2011 the survival rate with fawns is not near what it is in other places due to drought and predation. james Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scooter Report post Posted December 12, 2011 so alot of the fawns that I see with mama are not gonna make it through to the next monsoon season? okay, I see that point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SunDevil Report post Posted December 12, 2011 the survival rate with fawns is not near what it is in other places due to drought and predation. james well at least predation Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scooter Report post Posted December 12, 2011 So you're saying I need to step up my predator game??? No Problem... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
couesobsession Report post Posted December 12, 2011 I myself dont fully understand it. I guess the need for more does so they can produce as many fawns as possible becasue so many dont make it makes some sense. Just like you, I have seen many areas with a much higher doe to buck ratio then i would like to see, for my sake and the ecosystem's. The thing is there are a lot more bucks that you just arent seeing because they are much more elusive than does, so the buck to doe ratio isnt as disproportionate as you may think. There is one or two antlerless hunts, one being a antlerless tag (issued through the draw) for the Kaibab plateau. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
firstcoueswas80 Report post Posted December 13, 2011 I just spent Friday-now in 36b. We saw a total of about 110 or so deer..... 6 bucks. Saw 45 does on Friday. No bucks. Saw 27 does Saturday. No bucks. Saw about 25 or so deer Sunday, 5 bucks. Saw 11 deer today, one little spike. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 13, 2011 shooting predators is always recomended. where i hunted deer this year i only saw a couple of fawns. saw about 25 deer, whiteys and muleys. saw 6 bucks i think. one coues spike. coues weren't legal either. seems like the biologists shoot for 20 or 30 percent buck to doe ratio. it's been a long time since college, but it seems like that is a healthy ratio. if you are seeing a lot of does it is a good thing. bucks are harder to find. because of a lotta reasons. in some states shooting does is a good idea. i think they still have a jr doe hunt in 12a don't they? most of Az just doesn't have a lot of deer. if you start shooting a lot of does, we'll have less. my kid hunted in nebraska this year. in fact we're toying with the idea of going back for the muzzleloader hunt this month. they could shoot 2 bucks and 2 does on the rifle hunt. you can also do the same thing on the archery and muzzleloader hunts. even if you hunted all the hunts. they have a lotta deer. years ago if you made the trip to kaibab you had to shoot a doe and check it in before you could shoot a buck. then you could shoot another doe too. but that was a loooooooooog time ago. Lark. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
muleskinner Report post Posted December 13, 2011 Apparently lions prefer bucks...gender selective predation...we all know that any time there is a scarcity of deer spotted, gotta be a lion lurking in the shadows! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airbusdriver Report post Posted December 13, 2011 I know I'm comparing apples to oranges here, but I was amazed to learn that you can take five does PER DAY in Michigan. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azhuntnut Report post Posted December 13, 2011 Apparently lions prefer bucks...gender selective predation...we all know that any time there is a scarcity of deer spotted, gotta be a lion lurking in the shadows! Art, It seems like every post you make it has something to do with saving all the predators in this state, or saying something derogatory to one of the members. I am beginning to think you might be some type of animal activist "trolling" this site. You are going to have a hard time ever getting any help from anybody on this site when you draw a tag and can't figure out where to hunt. And to answer your question, most bucks live a solitary life and are much easier to kill since there aren't so many eyes looking out for that lion sneaking up behind them. You need to move to Cali. Before you make an uneducated response, go back and take a look at your post history. Sorry for the hijack scooter. David Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 13, 2011 it seems to me that you find more lion kiils that are bucks than you do does. but i've been told, and i believe it, that a buck will turn and try to fight a lion where a doe will just run off if they get the chance. trying to fight a lion is playing right into it's paws. but most of the time a lion is all about stealth and the animal is in the process of being killed before it knows it. most of the elk i've seen that lions killed were of the antleress variety tho. i've heard they can kill a big bull, but i've never seen it. seen where they killed a lotta calves and yearlings. as far as a lion doing any selective predation? no way. if they did they wouldn't kill so many porkypines. most every lion you catch has porkypine stickers in him. they kill a bunch of em because they are easy and happen to be there when they are hungry. a lion will kill a fawn, a doe, a buck, a skunk, a javelina, young bears, elk, cattle, you name it. they'll kill it. they ain't trophy hunters. it's just food to them. i've seen where they have killed other lions and eaten them. and foxes too. a smart old lion will sometimes find a trapline and figure out which way it runs and run it for you. seen that happen several times. they'll eat everything in your traps. don't know if they are just in the area and happen upon some of the traps or if they actually figure out there is some method to it or what, but i've seen em run a trapline before. sure pisses off the trapper too. but he can usually take care of the problem with a #6 newhouse. Lark. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yotebuster Report post Posted December 13, 2011 I always get a kick out of how people know a "lion kill" when they find one. You have 100,000 guys running around banging away at deer and elk every fall, most of them don't even sight in their .270's and bought the BDC reticle and take 600 yard shots without even checking to se if they drew blood. I would wager that a majority of the dead bucks or "lion kills" as most people call them are somehow related to a 130 gr soft point and not a 130 pound Tom. The reason it seems like you rarely find dead does is that how often do you pay attention to a pile of bones if there isn't a rack laying with it? You don't, you just walk by it and make sure there isnt a rack. Not saying lions don't eat deer, not saying I'll ever pass up a chance at any predator icluding a lion, just saying that the two legged predators in jacked up trucks account for waaaayyyy more kills then the lions. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
