HB 2072 Sale of big game tags

[40-year-AZ-hunter]

Bonusptjohn, perhaps as a member of the AzSFW Board you can help. I emailed the contact link on their site (Ms. Gilstrap's email) and asked how many individual paying members of AzSFW there are. I have not received a reply. I know the group cites a large figure for membership, but I believe most of those are people who belong only because they belong to one of the sponsoring organizations, not because they chose to. In fact, many may not agree with AzSFW positions. So, can you tell me how many individuals chose to pay the dues to belong?

 

Another other question relates to the control of the organization. Again, I looked on the site for a link to the organizations bylaws and did not find anything. Can you help? I'm particularly interesting in knowing how the Board is selected. Is it done by a vote of the membership (relates to the first question)?

 

I also did not see any accounting of the funds generated and spent by the organization. Is that available for reveiw?

 

Will individual hunters be invited to the meeting to discuss this bill? There are over 100,000 big game hunters in AZ and the vast majority do not belong to any of the sponsoring organizations, much less pay to be individual members of AzSFW (see first question). They would all be affected by this bill.

 

Thanks.

[.270]

"The AZSFW has done more to benefit hunters than any other group in this state. Your commission is protected for years into the future when we have a democrat as governor. The $3.5 million dollars from the legislature 5 years ago when times were good is only because of their efforts. Please, let's acknowledge some of the good things that have happened."

 

the above comment is pure, total, green, runny bull$h!t. the group in this state that has provided more funds, volunteered more hours, done more work and more good is the group that joe sportsman belongs too. the rank and file of Arizona hunters. every so called conservation group piled together x 10 hasn't done as much. so take that comment and go someplace else.

 

the silence by the outfitters on this site about this deal is deafening. same as it was when uso was trying to pull their tricks. wonder why? i can imagine why. a bunch of em are in on it. just like they were with the uso deal. this deal would benefit a few wealthy, well connected folks and not much else. the similarities between the two ploys are very interesting to say the least. glad the commission grew a pair and turned it down. it'll be back in awhile tho. with different clothes on, but it will be the same sorry rat that this is. Lark.

[elkaholic]

one last comment - i liked this guys responce ::

 

Why was this all being discussed behind closed doors?

I'd like to see where AZSFW actually asked their membership if they supported this crap or not?

 

Did AZSFW ask the hunters in AZ what they think of the bill?

 

Why wasnt the AZG&F asked?

 

How about the commission?

 

This group has taken corruption to all new levels and its more than obvious, as usual, that AZSFW doesnt really care what Arizona Hunters think.

 

SFW acts in the best interest of making money for themselves, period.

 

No accountability, no open books, nothing....just want more and this was by getting tags to peddle to the wealthy.

 

Business as usual at SFW Inc.

[stanley]

Are the administrators and/or board members for AZSFW paid or volunteers? If so, would the salaries be paid out of the funds generated by these tag sales? Is that part of the 'administrative' costs?

 

Seems like some of the riff in Utah is partly because of the whole 'auction tag' thing, but also due to the fact that some of the admins/board members were making large salaries. I know that the ADA board is not paid, and is volunteer only. How about AZSFW?

 

Just curious.....

 

S.

 

+1

 

We are not too far removed to remember the Fiesta Bowl and their "administrative" costs. Different arena same corruption

The AZSFW board is strictly volunteers initially, each of the beginning few who started the organization back several years ago were required to pony up some significant cash to be a board member. The only person who does get paid is Capitol Consulting, who acts as our lobbyist at the state legislature. I know of absolutely no lobbyist who would ever do the political infighting that has been necessary to carry the water for us who would do it as low as Suzanne and company have done.

 

Thanks for the reply, John.

 

I have a question regarding the wording in your statement though. You mention; "..... strickly volunteers initially". Is that referring to the fact that 'initially' the beginning few ponied-up money? Or is it indicating that it is 'initially' volunteers, but there could or might be paid positions in the future? Or will it always remain strickly volunteer? Again, I only ask because this seems to be a big bone of contention with SFW in other states, at least in Utah.

 

Lark, your point regarding no outfitter response is very insighful. No doubt that local outfitters would LOVE to have more big money tag holders to guide....

 

S.

[TLH]

The commission shot it down 5 to nothing and all of the people who spoke had nothing good to say about it. They went as far as to saying they will not support any part of the bill and that it should be shot down completely.

We should talk Terry, this bill had plenty of good things about it...JK... you know how to reach me if you would like to talk. We will be meeting with all the members of the AZSFWC next week to move forward and answer questions...

 

 

John, i do know your number and we will talk. The problem is everything that was good in this bill is now trashed because of the way it was handled. Yes i know that this would have done some good John but it was too covert and had too many things wrong with it. What needs to be done is to have all sportsman involved with this type of bill and then take what they all have to say and make it work. You and everyone one else need to not make the decision of this state on your own because it will never fly.

 

I would like to see some of these proposals re-written and then presented months in advance to everyone of these sites and the game and fish--John did you know that our commissioners had no idea what this was about? Do you think that is the way to get the commissioners on board with anything the AZSFW has to offer now?

 

Lastly--i do know that the AZSFW has done a lot of good things politically for this state but we have to know about this type of bill long before it gets shoved in our faces.

 

I am not sure how you as the President of the ADA could ever see any good out of this bill---if you had nothing to do with the AZSFW you would have looked at this just like the rest of us but because you have some kind of agenda with the AZSFW you push it. I do have to give you credit though John because you are the ONLY member that has come on these sites and tried to talk people into it.

[TLH]

Are the administrators and/or board members for AZSFW paid or volunteers? If so, would the salaries be paid out of the funds generated by these tag sales? Is that part of the 'administrative' costs?

 

Seems like some of the riff in Utah is partly because of the whole 'auction tag' thing, but also due to the fact that some of the admins/board members were making large salaries. I know that the ADA board is not paid, and is volunteer only. How about AZSFW?

 

Just curious.....

 

S.

 

+1

 

We are not too far removed to remember the Fiesta Bowl and their "administrative" costs. Different arena same corruption

The AZSFW board is strictly volunteers initially, each of the beginning few who started the organization back several years ago were required to pony up some significant cash to be a board member. The only person who does get paid is Capitol Consulting, who acts as our lobbyist at the state legislature. I know of absolutely no lobbyist who would ever do the political infighting that has been necessary to carry the water for us who would do it as low as Suzanne and company have done.

 

Thanks for the reply, John.

 

I have a question regarding the wording in your statement though. You mention; "..... strickly volunteers initially". Is that referring to the fact that 'initially' the beginning few ponied-up money? Or is it indicating that it is 'initially' volunteers, but there could or might be paid positions in the future? Or will it always remain strickly volunteer? Again, I only ask because this seems to be a big bone of contention with SFW in other states, at least in Utah.

 

Lark, your point regarding no outfitter response is very insighful. No doubt that local outfitters would LOVE to have more big money tag holders to guide....

 

S.

 

 

Stanly and Lark, i am an outfitter and guide and i want nothing to do with this. Besides guys we get hunters every year no matter what so to say we have a lot to do with it is probably wrong--or at least with me and my crew it is. We literally turn people away each year.

[bonuspointjohn]

one last comment - i liked this guys responce ::

 

Why was this all being discussed behind closed doors?

I'd like to see where AZSFW actually asked their membership if they supported this crap or not?

 

Did AZSFW ask the hunters in AZ what they think of the bill?

 

Why wasnt the AZG&F asked?

 

How about the commission?

 

This group has taken corruption to all new levels and its more than obvious, as usual, that AZSFW doesnt really care what Arizona Hunters think.

 

SFW acts in the best interest of making money for themselves, period.

 

No accountability, no open books, nothing....just want more and this was by getting tags to peddle to the wealthy.

 

Business as usual at SFW Inc.

Just curious how the AZSFW has made a penny in the past 6 years of existence... I know you have not paid a dime... nor have all the other "experts" who are chiming in. The real truth is that several very dedicated sportsmen who do have deep pockets put together this organization.... And paid for it out of their own pockets. No one on the board makes a penny, never has... Statements that charge otherwise are blatantly false.

[elkaholic]

one last comment - i liked this guys responce ::

 

Why was this all being discussed behind closed doors?

I'd like to see where AZSFW actually asked their membership if they supported this crap or not?

 

Did AZSFW ask the hunters in AZ what they think of the bill?

 

Why wasnt the AZG&F asked?

 

How about the commission?

 

This group has taken corruption to all new levels and its more than obvious, as usual, that AZSFW doesnt really care what Arizona Hunters think.

 

SFW acts in the best interest of making money for themselves, period.

 

No accountability, no open books, nothing....just want more and this was by getting tags to peddle to the wealthy.

 

Business as usual at SFW Inc.

Just curious how the AZSFW has made a penny in the past 6 years of existence... I know you have not paid a dime... nor have all the other "experts" who are chiming in. The real truth is that several very dedicated sportsmen who do have deep pockets put together this organization.... And paid for it out of their own pockets. No one on the board makes a penny, never has... Statements that charge otherwise are blatantly false.

 

 

do you have an answer for the first 5 questions ??

[bonuspointjohn]

Are the administrators and/or board members for AZSFW paid or volunteers? If so, would the salaries be paid out of the funds generated by these tag sales? Is that part of the 'administrative' costs?

 

Seems like some of the riff in Utah is partly because of the whole 'auction tag' thing, but also due to the fact that some of the admins/board members were making large salaries. I know that the ADA board is not paid, and is volunteer only. How about AZSFW?

 

Just curious.....

 

S.

 

+1

There was an initial expenditure to cover the cost of the lobbyist. That is and always has been the only paid position. Over the years, the AES, ADA, ADSBSS and the AAF have contributed to having Capitol Consulting as their lobbyist. Prior to that, the founding members all kicked in some serious money on behalf of sportsmen... and some continue to do so to this day... NO ONE ELSE GETS PAID....... can't get any clearer than that... Call me Terry..

We are not too far removed to remember the Fiesta Bowl and their "administrative" costs. Different arena same corruption

The AZSFW board is strictly volunteers initially, each of the beginning few who started the organization back several years ago were required to pony up some significant cash to be a board member. The only person who does get paid is Capitol Consulting, who acts as our lobbyist at the state legislature. I know of absolutely no lobbyist who would ever do the political infighting that has been necessary to carry the water for us who would do it as low as Suzanne and company have done.

 

Thanks for the reply, John.

 

I have a question regarding the wording in your statement though. You mention; "..... strickly volunteers initially". Is that referring to the fact that 'initially' the beginning few ponied-up money? Or is it indicating that it is 'initially' volunteers, but there could or might be paid positions in the future? Or will it always remain strickly volunteer? Again, I only ask because this seems to be a big bone of contention with SFW in other states, at least in Utah.

 

Lark, your point regarding no outfitter response is very insighful. No doubt that local outfitters would LOVE to have more big money tag holders to guide....

 

S.

 

 

Stanly and Lark, i am an outfitter and guide and i want nothing to do with this. Besides guys we get hunters every year no matter what so to say we have a lot to do with it is probably wrong--or at least with me and my crew it is. We literally turn people away each year.

[bonuspointjohn]

Bonusptjohn, perhaps as a member of the AzSFW Board you can help. I emailed the contact link on their site (Ms. Gilstrap's email) and asked how many individual paying members of AzSFW there are. I have not received a reply. I know the group cites a large figure for membership, but I believe most of those are people who belong only because they belong to one of the sponsoring organizations, not because they chose to. In fact, many may not agree with AzSFW positions. So, can you tell me how many individuals chose to pay the dues to belong?

 

Another other question relates to the control of the organization. Again, I looked on the site for a link to the organizations bylaws and did not find anything. Can you help? I'm particularly interesting in knowing how the Board is selected. Is it done by a vote of the membership (relates to the first question)?

 

I also did not see any accounting of the funds generated and spent by the organization. Is that available for reveiw?

 

Will individual hunters be invited to the meeting to discuss this bill? There are over 100,000 big game hunters in AZ and the vast majority do not belong to any of the sponsoring organizations, much less pay to be individual members of AzSFW (see first question). They would all be affected by this bill.

 

Thanks.

I am a member of the AZSFWC board. It is the group that would handle the money distribution and is NON PROFIT. There are several members elected to that group, and all belong or are on the boards of the other critter groups. There will be a meeting to discuss the bill next week, and all of the board members from all of the AZSFWC members are invited. Stay tuned, more is to follow.

[bonuspointjohn]

Are the administrators and/or board members for AZSFW paid or volunteers? If so, would the salaries be paid out of the funds generated by these tag sales? Is that part of the 'administrative' costs?

 

Seems like some of the riff in Utah is partly because of the whole 'auction tag' thing, but also due to the fact that some of the admins/board members were making large salaries. I know that the ADA board is not paid, and is volunteer only. How about AZSFW?

 

Just curious.....

 

S.

 

+1

There was an initial expenditure to cover the cost of the lobbyist. That is and always has been the only paid position. Over the years, the AES, ADA, ADSBSS and the AAF have contributed to having Capitol Consulting as their lobbyist. Prior to that, the founding members all kicked in some serious money on behalf of sportsmen... and some continue to do so to this day... NO ONE ELSE GETS PAID....... can't get any clearer than that... Call me Terry..

We are not too far removed to remember the Fiesta Bowl and their "administrative" costs. Different arena same corruption

The AZSFW board is strictly volunteers initially, each of the beginning few who started the organization back several years ago were required to pony up some significant cash to be a board member. The only person who does get paid is Capitol Consulting, who acts as our lobbyist at the state legislature. I know of absolutely no lobbyist who would ever do the political infighting that has been necessary to carry the water for us who would do it as low as Suzanne and company have done.

 

Thanks for the reply, John.

 

I have a question regarding the wording in your statement though. You mention; "..... strickly volunteers initially". Is that referring to the fact that 'initially' the beginning few ponied-up money? Or is it indicating that it is 'initially' volunteers, but there could or might be paid positions in the future? Or will it always remain strickly volunteer? Again, I only ask because this seems to be a big bone of contention with SFW in other states, at least in Utah.

 

Lark, your point regarding no outfitter response is very insighful. No doubt that local outfitters would LOVE to have more big money tag holders to guide....

 

S.

 

 

Stanly and Lark, i am an outfitter and guide and i want nothing to do with this. Besides guys we get hunters every year no matter what so to say we have a lot to do with it is probably wrong--or at least with me and my crew it is. We literally turn people away each year.

Terry is correct. There are no guides or outfitters who had anything to do with creation of or contemplation of this bill.

[glasmup]

I am a guide and could benifit from this... My opinion is a firm heck NO! Not going to repeat anything that has already been said but anything that tries to sneak in the back door is no good!!!!!!

[coueswt]

I do not want AZ to be anything like how Utah is right now. Look at the # of conservation/commissoner/governor tags issued in Utah and what has happened to their quality of game, it's crazy stupid. How many of these tags go to residents? I know some guides that would sure be happy(probably supporting this and others to come)chasing and taking the biggest elk, deer, sheep, etc.... every year by someone that has deep pockets that is buying these tags.

 

How can anyone think, resident and non-resident, that giving a big # of premimum tags like this would not have an impact on the rest of us drawing a tag and impact our quality of hunt and game. Ask the average Utah die hard hunter, like most of us, what they think about what has happened to their state currently?

[aznate]

Most non-profit organizations are only required to use 10% of the money they bring in for the stated purpose, 90% of the money goes to salaries and advertising for more money. It doesn't seem to matter what the non-profit is, and executive salaries are commonly $250,000.00 on up. Why can't the bill be written so that all the money goes to AZ Game and Fish as a fund, specifically to help big game species?

 

 

This is my opinion-

 

Please do not proceed with HB2072. This bill does not help AZ Game and Fish nor the average hunter of Arizona. This bill will create more "big game hunting tags for auction", creating an unfair and unethical system of tag distribution, while generating funds for only one non-profit organization. Many people wait years for a quality tag, and as our big game are a finite resource, the tags should remain available to all, not just those who can afford to buy a tag at auction.

 

No matter what a non-profit organization says, large amounts of money always seem to be paid in either salaries or advertising for more funds. There are already big game tags given to several non-profit organizations, which are then auctioned for revenue generation for the non-profit. Please, NO more state tags should be allocated to generate funds for any non-profit groups! These groups should be given donations by the members of said group, and should not be involved in big game tags.

[Rag Horn]

I don't mean to beat a dead horse but the fiesta bowl is non profit too.

 

Fastest way to make a million dollars is start a non profit organization.

 

The fact that they are non profit does not mean I should trust them or that they are not making money. Look at how much the big wigs of the red cross make each year.