Champ and Crossbow Permit Proposed Changes

[trphyhntr]

1 hour ago, EarlyBronco said:

My rifle only shoots 750 yards… I gotta get a new scope

just hold the crosshair higher 

[Flatlander]

8 minutes ago, jdown said:

All for champ hunts and xbow - just for those that need it vs anyone pos that has a sore shoulder. Nothing wrong with regulation to keep it fair from those that abuse the intent. 

If you read the new rule, someone who is applying for a crossbow permit now has to go see a specialist, who performs a function test and writes a “narrative” justifying his professional assesment, that then must be delivered in person or via mail to a dept office and the process has to be renewed every year.

Anybody scheduled an appointment with a specialist lately? 6-9 months is the norm unless there is an acute injury. Ever try it at the VA? Double that.

Oh yeah, gotta pay for appointment too.

If he is a CHAMP holder, repeat that same process for the CHAMP application.

Then the applicant will have to find a crossbow, remove the optics, purchase a 1x optic (I think there is 1 on the market right now) and reattach it and resight.

Meanwhile, they still have to deal with whatever injury or illness qualifies them for the permit in the first place.

The commission can pat themselves on the back all they want for a good compromise and I am sure they will sleep just fine. The flat brimmed hunting bro’s can enjoy their otc archery for a couple more years and the influencers can keep their likes up until it’s overrun.

A few abusers will decide the extra headache isn’t worth the hassle anymore. Many of them will write the narrative themself and still get their permit signed by their buddy who is an ortho. 

And the people who this whole system was created for? They’ll either decide that all these extra hurdles aren’t worth it or aren’t feasible with their daily life that already includes way more PIA factor than most of us even bother to consider, or a few of the really resilient ones who are at a good place in their life and have the means will dip duck dive dodge duck all the wrenches that keep getting thrown at  them.

Good job everybody, way to go.

[jdown]

Be mad at the DHs that abused it. Guys that had their 10 year olds shooting xbow because the kid didn’t put in the work or the dude holding a 80lb head and rack above is head but couldn’t pull 50lbs all of a sudden. Lots and lots of examples. 

[WalkingW]

  The recent restrictions on equipment like tripods don’t just hurt convenience—they hurt people. I’ve worked hands-on with hunters who are blind, quadriplegic, or missing limbs, building gear and systems that allow them to experience what many take for granted: the freedom and joy of the hunt. I want to ask you how am I going to setup for a quadriplegic, or someone that is missing/has no use of both limbs or blind hunter without a tripod? Or should we just tell them “sorry you don’t deserve to hunt”
  Until I began helping disabled hunters, I never fully grasped the enormous obstacles they overcome just to participate. Taking away tools that make hunting possible for them isn’t just inconvenient—it’s cruel.  
 If we allow decisions to be swayed by a vocal minority concerned more with gatekeeping than inclusion, we all risk losing access in the long run. Disability can happen to any of us at any time.
  Hunting should be accessible to everyone. It’s not about trophy scores, ego, or elitism—it’s about tradition, connection to nature, getting away from normal day to day the opportunity get away from Dr. and hospitals for some. 
 To make the lives of a group of innocent people that already have massive struggles much more difficult is nothing short of an outrage! 
  I hope that our commissioners will stop and think what adverse effects will have.

[jdown]

Champ permit holders using bipods or sticks would not concern me. Hope they rethink that one. The rest seems like a necessity to try and keep it in hands of those that actually need it. 

[Crazymonkey]

43 minutes ago, WalkingW said:

  The recent restrictions on equipment like tripods don’t just hurt convenience—they hurt people. I’ve worked hands-on with hunters who are blind, quadriplegic, or missing limbs, building gear and systems that allow them to experience what many take for granted: the freedom and joy of the hunt. I want to ask you how am I going to setup for a quadriplegic, or someone that is missing/has no use of both limbs or blind hunter without a tripod? Or should we just tell them “sorry you don’t deserve to hunt”
  Until I began helping disabled hunters, I never fully grasped the enormous obstacles they overcome just to participate. Taking away tools that make hunting possible for them isn’t just inconvenient—it’s cruel.  
 If we allow decisions to be swayed by a vocal minority concerned more with gatekeeping than inclusion, we all risk losing access in the long run. Disability can happen to any of us at any time.
  Hunting should be accessible to everyone. It’s not about trophy scores, ego, or elitism—it’s about tradition, connection to nature, getting away from normal day to day the opportunity get away from Dr. and hospitals for some. 
 To make the lives of a group of innocent people that already have massive struggles much more difficult is nothing short of an outrage! 
  I hope that our commissioners will stop and think what adverse effects will have.

Last year when I was helping  on a champ hunt we were  on a good bull only to have the rifle scope  camera white wash with  the fog and snow . This bull was our target bull and as the fog cleared  another  hunter came from  the other side of the trail and it was all over for us as the bull got up and walked  outa our view . 

Lots of obstacles  for disabled  hunters .

[Tony Nile]

2 hours ago, jdown said:

Champ permit holders using bipods or sticks would not concern me. Hope they rethink that one. The rest seems like a necessity to try and keep it in hands of those that actually need it. 

 

3 hours ago, WalkingW said:

  The recent restrictions on equipment like tripods don’t just hurt convenience—they hurt people. I’ve worked hands-on with hunters who are blind, quadriplegic, or missing limbs, building gear and systems that allow them to experience what many take for granted: the freedom and joy of the hunt. I want to ask you how am I going to setup for a quadriplegic, or someone that is missing/has no use of both limbs or blind hunter without a tripod? Or should we just tell them “sorry you don’t deserve to hunt”
  Until I began helping disabled hunters, I never fully grasped the enormous obstacles they overcome just to participate. Taking away tools that make hunting possible for them isn’t just inconvenient—it’s cruel.  
 If we allow decisions to be swayed by a vocal minority concerned more with gatekeeping than inclusion, we all risk losing access in the long run. Disability can happen to any of us at any time.
  Hunting should be accessible to everyone. It’s not about trophy scores, ego, or elitism—it’s about tradition, connection to nature, getting away from normal day to day the opportunity get away from Dr. and hospitals for some. 
 To make the lives of a group of innocent people that already have massive struggles much more difficult is nothing short of an outrage! 
  I hope that our commissioners will stop and think what adverse effects will have.

CHAMP can still use a device to hold the crossbow.  Why are you so fired up?

[old sparky]

Has anyone heard. How a person goes about getting a refund for a lifetime permit?

[Coues247]

54 minutes ago, old sparky said:

Has anyone heard. How a person goes about getting a refund for a lifetime permit?

You don't. .nonrefundable 

[trphyhntr]

2 hours ago, old sparky said:

Has anyone heard. How a person goes about getting a refund for a lifetime permit?

You’re turning in your hunting license over the crossbow situation? 

[PRDATR]

3 hours ago, old sparky said:

Has anyone heard. How a person goes about getting a refund for a lifetime permit?

How much will you be out? 

[old sparky]

My crossbow permit was issued as a lifetime permit. The portal has the permit expiration as 2199. If they can takeaway a permit they issued as lifetime. What prevents them from taking away other lifetime permits? 

[Roofer Billy]

11 hours ago, EarlyBronco said:

My rifle only shoots 750 yards… I gotta get a new scope

It can only be 1x. 

[Roofer Billy]

10 hours ago, Flatlander said:

If you read the new rule, someone who is applying for a crossbow permit now has to go see a specialist, who performs a function test and writes a “narrative” justifying his professional assesment, that then must be delivered in person or via mail to a dept office and the process has to be renewed every year.

Anybody scheduled an appointment with a specialist lately? 6-9 months is the norm unless there is an acute injury. Ever try it at the VA? Double that.

Oh yeah, gotta pay for appointment too.

If he is a CHAMP holder, repeat that same process for the CHAMP application.

Then the applicant will have to find a crossbow, remove the optics, purchase a 1x optic (I think there is 1 on the market right now) and reattach it and resight.

Meanwhile, they still have to deal with whatever injury or illness qualifies them for the permit in the first place.

The commission can pat themselves on the back all they want for a good compromise and I am sure they will sleep just fine. The flat brimmed hunting bro’s can enjoy their otc archery for a couple more years and the influencers can keep their likes up until it’s overrun.

A few abusers will decide the extra headache isn’t worth the hassle anymore. Many of them will write the narrative themself and still get their permit signed by their buddy who is an ortho. 

And the people who this whole system was created for? They’ll either decide that all these extra hurdles aren’t worth it or aren’t feasible with their daily life that already includes way more PIA factor than most of us even bother to consider, or a few of the really resilient ones who are at a good place in their life and have the means will dip duck dive dodge duck all the wrenches that keep getting thrown at  them.

Good job everybody, way to go.

Could not have written that better myself. .

If I only have one arm. Why would I need to renew my permit ? The injury is permanent. I'm not growing a new arm . No surgery , medicine or anything will change that. So why the heck would I need to go back every year to renew my permit? F- ing stupid morons.

My Dad's been waiting 17 months now. To get into a Arthritis Doctor. His last Doctors office was in Pinetop. He had to drive once a month there from Mesa. Now He goes without Medicine. He already has to live in constant pain. Trying to hunt is nearly impossible. His Crossbow was His way of being able to get out. Now He has sold everything. And will never hunt again. Hunting is what keeps Dad alive. It give Him purpose and something to look forward to. A actuall time and day . Opening morning 😀. Now what ??? 

 

 

[Roofer Billy]

3 hours ago, trphyhntr said:

You’re turning in your hunting license over the crossbow situation? 

Yup if a Crossbow is your only way of hunting. Why have a licence. Fuckkkk Arizona. Go hunt a different state.